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Thread: [IMO] DON'T use ZiPhone 2.5 on a 4.6 BL phone

  1. #21
    iPhone? More like MyPhone
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eurisko View Post
    ZiPhone when used according to directions has never caused any iPhone to brick. Zibri knows how ZiPhone does things because he made it, and I'll take his word over yours.

    Are you serious? I unlock phones on craiglist and have done about 150. When ZiPhone came out all I got were calls from people bricking their phone, and I refused to use it and stayed with the DevTeam 1.1.3. Its all about STABILITY, at least it is in my case. Because i personally hate having to redo my phone after it bricks because I installed Dock, or something stupid like that.

    Even the new version of ZiPhone is buggy. I finally said I would try using it on a 1.1.4 install on my personal iphone, and I get tons of dropped and failed calls.

    Im not hating on Zibri, but just because you write code, doesnt mean you write THE BEST code. And he put together a nice little suite to automate the whole jailbreak+unlock process. Cool. But he didnt write EVERYTHING that is part of the ZiPhone software, so credit is due in a lot more places as well

  2. #22
    Livin the iPhone Life Eurisko's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by iphonejeff View Post
    no it doesnot update the bootloader on an itunes update/restore..
    lol. Excellent slight. I know when I'm beaten.

    Quote Originally Posted by frankydabull View Post
    Are you serious? I unlock phones on craiglist and have done about 150.

    Im not hating on Zibri, but just because you write code, doesnt mean you write THE BEST code. And he put together a nice little suite to automate the whole jailbreak+unlock process. Cool. But he didnt write EVERYTHING that is part of the ZiPhone software, so credit is due in a lot more places as well
    Interesting take. So because you've unlocked 150 phones, you're implying that makes you an authority; yet in your next paragraph you're saying just because Zibri wrote the code that doesn't mean he did it right. Interesting.

    As for Ziphone, yes I'm aware that Geohot actually provided the majority of the guts to this process. Here's a theory though: as the filesystem is always the same once a restore is done, that means all unlocks/JB/activates should work, QED. But since some don't, wouldn't it be logical to say the problem is not with the program, but the person who uses it?
    Last edited by Eurisko; 2008-03-12 at 02:19 AM. Reason: Corrected myself
    Get "iPod & iTunes for Dummies", it'll change your life.

  3. #23
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    dam! i remember back at the end of last year when all people had where expensive iPod Touch's and everything was crossing their fingers for a bootloader downgrade to enable a software unlock and now this thread....... dam.

    i have and doubt ever will use ZiPhone as i have seen many threads on the forums regarding problems after the unlock, i dont want to have to encounter any problems with my iPhone and don't see the need for an automated jailbreak/unlock process as it is.

    But, even though i don't and won't ever use it, i don't feel the need to start a thread hating on new software which has helped thousands of people across the world with no issues at all.

  4. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by Eurisko View Post
    As for Ziphone, yes I'm aware that Geohot actually provided the majority of the guts to this process. Here's a theory though: as the filesystem is always the same once a restore is done, that means all unlocks/JB/activates should work, QED. But since some don't, wouldn't it be logical to say the problem is not with the program, but the person who uses it?
    Here is the reason: although the filesystem on the phones are equal, they are connected to different PC/Macs during the ramdisk exploit. What happens when the iPhone boots and reboots for this process is that it connects disconnects and reconnects as different devices to the computer.

    That said, there is a handshake between parties and this is different on every single instance of the process.

    Change the version of iTunes and it will be different...

    How many people fail to restore? How many times the only solution to properly restoring a phone is to reboot the PC or Mac? How many different versions of iTunes around (and the exploit uses iTunes libraries and services).

    Bottom line: it is always different. So a mere "retry" of the processes can solve the problem.

    For that same reason (combined with other problems) is that the ramdisk is dangerous and even worse, non-deterministic.

    That's why after discussing this issue with the Dev-Team I decided to move away from the ramdisk for actual unlocking or activation. Now it's only used for jailbreaking on my program. The rest is done under the normal OS for safety reasons.

  5. #25
    awesome thread, lets keep it going guys

  6. #26
    Livin the iPhone Life Eurisko's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by aviegas View Post
    Now it's only used for jailbreaking on my program. The rest is done under the normal OS for safety reasons.
    Your program? What's your program? Is it for your own use or widely available?
    Get "iPod & iTunes for Dummies", it'll change your life.

  7. #27
    Quote Originally Posted by Eurisko View Post
    Your program? What's your program? Is it for your own use or widely available?
    It is widely available: http://www.hackint0sh.org/forum/showthread.php?t=33613

    I have used it on several phones.
    aviegas approach to downgrade the BL to 3.9 FakeBlank (if needed) is much safer than ZiPhone because it is done outside the ramdisk.

  8. #28
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    We still haven't been given any evidence Ziphone is "unsafe". imho, I think your and the others problem isn't with Ziphone, but Zibri, as you allege he stole code from the Dev team. Payback maybe?
    Get "iPod & iTunes for Dummies", it'll change your life.

  9. #29
    Quote Originally Posted by Eurisko View Post
    We still haven't been given any evidence Ziphone is "unsafe". imho, I think your and the others problem isn't with Ziphone, but Zibri, as you allege he stole code from the Dev team. Payback maybe?
    I hold nothing against Zibri.

    My point area:

    1) ziPhone uses 3.9 in lieu of 3.9FB that is a much better alternative. Time will tell about this one! But I like to play it safe here.

    2) ziPhone performs unlocks and downgrades while running the ramdisk image. It is plain dangerous. That is probably the cause of the missing Wifi and other stuff from the baseband.

    iPlus version 1.x used that approach too and as a result there were several phones that needed a second pass to fix a "Repair Needed" due to errors in the unlock. Luckly that was fixable.

    iPlus 2.0 will not perform anything risky while running the ramdisk (just jailbreak). All the rest is performed in normal OS that is stable enough for the tasks at hand.

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  11. #30
    My iPhone is a Part of Me lillewis51's Avatar
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    the only problem i have with ziphone is when it downgrades the bootloader there is no way to undo it (which i need to do because i need to return the phone because i have almost 100-200 stuck pixles)

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  13. #31
    Default Not much to add...
    Quote Originally Posted by aviegas View Post
    I hold nothing against Zibri.

    My point area:

    1) ziPhone uses 3.9 in lieu of 3.9FB that is a much better alternative. Time will tell about this one! But I like to play it safe here.

    2) ziPhone performs unlocks and downgrades while running the ramdisk image. It is plain dangerous. That is probably the cause of the missing Wifi and other stuff from the baseband.

    iPlus version 1.x used that approach too and as a result there were several phones that needed a second pass to fix a "Repair Needed" due to errors in the unlock. Luckly that was fixable.

    iPlus 2.0 will not perform anything risky while running the ramdisk (just jailbreak). All the rest is performed in normal OS that is stable enough for the tasks at hand.
    Not much to add to that.

    Eurusko, Aviegas is WAAAY qualified to critique ziphone. iPlus is superior in every respect.

    Ask Zibri why he hasnt patched afc2 yet, or added 3.9Blank His answer..."Its DANGEROUS". Well, I say Bullshits! :-)

    Anyone using ziphone now when there is a better & safer option has been given bad advice.

    Euriskos, dont keep the ziphone myth alive, especially when your own knowledge has been proved to be um...flawed.

    Remember, ziphone is also morally suspect. He stole from Pumpkin and cannot update the code safely. Thats two strikes right there.

    Come take a look at iPlus (ipluspwns.blogspot.com) and discuss the facts with people who really know their stuff...have even JB'ed 2.0 already.

    geeb

    Quote Originally Posted by lillewis51 View Post
    the only problem i have with ziphone is when it downgrades the bootloader there is no way to undo it (which i need to do because i need to return the phone because i have almost 100-200 stuck pixles)
    Yup and that's a big problem...use iPlus and 3.9Blank next time.
    Last edited by geeb; 2008-03-12 at 03:51 PM. Reason: Automerged Doublepost

  14. #32
    The bootloader upgrade question still remains to be clarified

  15. #33
    Quote Originally Posted by Eurisko View Post
    We still haven't been given any evidence Ziphone is "unsafe". imho, I think your and the others problem isn't with Ziphone, but Zibri, as you allege he stole code from the Dev team. Payback maybe?
    The reason for creating this thread was not discuss how ZiPhone does the job.

    I've opened the thread to alert people that the current version of ZiPhone WILL downgrade your BL to 3.9 OTB and that is irreversible by software. (unless you open the phone and use the A17 testpoint)

    With previous versions of ZiPhone you had a choice to downgrade or not the BL.

    With version 2.5 Zibri decided to remove the option and didn't clear state that on a README or any other way.

    When he released ZiPhone 2.5, BL 3.9 FakeBlank was available and he could have used it but he didn't.

    With BL 3.9 FakeBlank you get the 3.9 OTB functionality plus reversibility.

    Why is reversibility important?

    Supose you have a phone that was originally shipped with a 4.6 BL.
    You've unlocked it and ended up with a 3.9 BL.
    Suddenly your battery goes nuts and don't retain charge anymore.
    You want to return the phone to Apple for a replacement.
    With a reversible 3.9 BL, you can "revirginise" the phone and Apple would never tell that the phone was once jailbroken and unlocked.
    With a 3.9 OTB bootloader you can't revirginise.
    While I have a friend that went to an Apple store with an unlocked phone and successfully exchanded it, I've heard of others that were turned down on their request to exchange a unlocked phone.

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  17. #34
    My iPhone is a Part of Me lillewis51's Avatar
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    can i change the 3.9 to 3.9 fake blank and then upgrade back to 4.6?

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  19. #35
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    I dont know what you guys have been doing , but iv used Ziphone since the beginning and iv used it on several differant phones now and not once have i encounted problems, everything works perfect calls, wifi everything. Iv installed loads of apps and still the iphone is stable, iv not had one complain as of yet about iphone bricking or freezing using this method..

    Im not a coder like you lot, but i can say this program is safe and stable.

  20. #36
    My iPhone is a Part of Me lillewis51's Avatar
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    and eurisko's insident with itunes upgrading his bootloader didnt happen when i tried

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  22. #37
    Quote Originally Posted by lillewis51 View Post
    can i change the 3.9 to 3.9 fake blank and then upgrade back to 4.6?
    Only by opening your phone and hitting those testpoints...

  23. #38
    My iPhone is a Part of Me lillewis51's Avatar
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    am i screwed or will apple replace it without knowing its the wrong bootloader

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  25. #39
    Quote Originally Posted by Rustynuts View Post
    I dont know what you guys have been doing , but iv used Ziphone since the beginning and iv used it on several differant phones now and not once have i encounted problems, everything works perfect calls, wifi everything. Iv installed loads of apps and still the iphone is stable, iv not had one complain as of yet about iphone bricking or freezing using this method..

    Im not a coder like you lot, but i can say this program is safe and stable.
    Like this thread says, you CANNOT now upgrade back to 4.6 without a lot of effort.

    If Apple decide to check serial against BL ver, there is going to be a shitstorm.

    Quote Originally Posted by lillewis51 View Post
    am i screwed or will apple replace it without knowing its the wrong bootloader
    Well, depends how deep they look...
    Last edited by geeb; 2008-03-12 at 03:59 PM. Reason: Automerged Doublepost

  26. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by buzios View Post
    Supose you have a phone that was originally shipped with a 4.6 BL.
    You've unlocked it and ended up with a 3.9 BL.
    Suddenly your battery goes nuts and don't retain charge anymore.
    You want to return the phone to Apple for a replacement.
    With a reversible 3.9 BL, you can "revirginise" the phone and Apple would never tell that the phone was once jailbroken and unlocked.
    With a 3.9 OTB bootloader you can't revirginise.
    While I have a friend that went to an Apple store with an unlocked phone and successfully exchanded it, I've heard of others that were turned down on their request to exchange a unlocked phone.
    When you jailbreak a phone, your warranty is void, we all know it. So trying to take it back to Apple is just as "morally suspect" as geeb's hearsay comment about Zibri and Pumpkin.

    So you guys go on with your debate without me, you'll be happy to hear that. All I go by is what I see, do and experience. Not by what I'm told, which to say the least is extremely conflicted. I'll continue to use Ziphone as it has never caused me any problems.
    Get "iPod & iTunes for Dummies", it'll change your life.

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