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Thread: Beware of future updates from apple!!!

  1. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eurisko View Post
    That wasn't testing the law, it was using the law to bring Microsoft to account for their actions. Hardly the same thing.
    I agree and disagree. I remember several companies going out of business because of Microsoft and the 'then current' laws which supported their actions.

    One thing we can be sure of .... time changes everything. What was true (aka 'law') in the past, may not necessarily be true in the future.

  2. #42
    iPhone? More like MyPhone iMack007's Avatar
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    IF .....and that really is a big IF...Apple takes legal action against Jailbreaking (which allows for 'ANY' 3rd part developed apps), then a counter law suit (backed by owners of said iPhones) should propose to agree to simply concede to Jailbreaking on the basis that Apple removes 'All' restricions they put in place to allow 'any' 3rd party developers to do develop apps that meet end users requests/requirements or that they 'must' by law fill that void themselves!!
    We all know that that isn't going to happen. In which case the courts (if it goes thatta way) should rule in favour of the people on the basis of the anti-monopoly laws which are in place.

    Another strange e ame of the hypocrisy of it all. We all know that each country has maximum speed limits in place, yet each car manufacturer produces cars that can easily break these speed limits. Should not all the worlds car manyfacturers be taken to court for Intentionally building cars which are designed, in essence, to do just that?
    This whole ....ing debacle is a total shambles and the so called 'courts of law' should not be used by these control hungry corporations and the likes of Apple should be sued for exploiting the laws in this way!!

    Seriously though, if Apple takes this **** to court, I'll bail out of all or even any future products of theirs just on principle. They are so damn greedy it's unreal!! Microsoft build their own mobile OS and they leave it at that and leave the apps development to 3rd party developers this leaving the onus on each developer to what they think is right to protect their own software, which is fair. But NO, not Apple! They have to get in on all aspects of softwars development and when faced with the reality that as big as they are, they cannot control all people and developers, they ***** about it and cry to the courts about it.
    Wake up Apple!! You were on a winner with the iPhone, but this type of negative publicity about your control freakish ways will more likely have a devastating affect on future sales accross all of your products and not just the iPhone!!
    Iwish they would take all the owners to court already, but they won't, so the giant bullies pick on the smaller individuals like developers who are doing what Apple should be, if they were legitamately tryi g to sow up the market.
    I logged here tonight to keRn about further developments on other 'missing features' or should I say 'deliberately withheld' features and all I seem to read these days is about Apple bitchin' as usual.
    They are acting so stupidly. Apple.... Remove your pathetic restrictions and let developers do what you will not and scrap your 'approval' process to allow these apps into your store. Then, as brilliant as Cydia is, there will be no need for it or jailbreaking! Duh, it's not exactly rocket-science is it?

    Excuse any spelling mistakes peeps, typing this from one of Apples flawed overpriced iPhones ;-)

  3. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mes View Post
    I agree and disagree. I remember several companies going out of business because of Microsoft and the 'then current' laws which supported their actions.
    The whole fiasco started when Microsoft made Internet Explorer an integral part of the OS, and it could not be uninstalled without shutting down the entire system. Netscape (remember them?) and others went after them using the anti-trust laws. Eventually governments got involved and uncovered many more serious offenses, and gave Microsoft a spanking.

    In this situation, lets be frank, the people responsible for breaking into and modifying Apple's copyrighted software don't want to be held accountable. Simple as that. And their using the guise that it's "unfair" for Apple to (rightfully) lock their OS on the iPhone.
    Get "iPod & iTunes for Dummies", it'll change your life.

  4. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eurisko View Post
    .. it's "unfair" for Apple to (rightfully) lock their OS on the iPhone.
    And I agree, don't you? If Apple 'leased' the phone to me, then they can control what I do with it, and how I use it.

    But this was a purchase, plain and simple. It belongs to me. Apple restricts my rights, and let's be frank; not because of copyright issues, but because of competition. It the god-almighty $$$ that drives their legal department. Innovate - not litigate

    In truth, the iPhone is just another computer. Abeit smaller, and with phone capabilities, but it is a computer. And it should be put in the same category as all other computers and given the freedom to use whatever OS the user desires.

  5. #45
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    what i find funny is that apple doesn't want people to "hack" the iphone, but the people who founded the company to begin with, they were hackers when they first started out weren't they? kind of hypocritical isn't it? and i know that they don't do any hacking anymore but they were still founded by hackers. So apple should appreciate them because they make technological advances just like everybody else.

    plus the people who develop apps and programs for anyone, aren't they hackers to. i mean they code and everything just like "hackers". Right? i mean i could be wrong. i don't know much about this stuff but thats the way i look at things.

  6. #46
    Livin the iPhone Life sziklassy's Avatar
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    The idea of being able to do what you want with YOUR device has been around much longer than many think. Modding video game consoles to play homebrew (and yes most people mod to play pirated games in the video games scene anyway) has been taken away from consumers since home consoles were around, for the most part. Seeing as how they are able to get away with busting people for modchips or software mods of video games, I assume Apple will be able to take this to an equally high level and do the same. That being said, these companies rarely (if ever) go after the 20 year old college kid installing a mod chip in their Xbox. not to say that Apple won;t do that, but they have bigger fish to fry (like all the repos pumping out all the pirated games/apps(. The sad thing is, that most people who pirate stuff probably wouldn't even buy the app/game in the first place, so they are really not generating revenue by "forcing" people to buy because, well, they would rather just go without than pay for the damn thing.
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  7. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by keatonec View Post
    what i find funny is that apple doesn't want people to "hack" the iphone, but the people who founded the company to begin with, they were hackers when they first started out weren't they? ....
    Great point . You know, I've lived in several engineering departments over the years. I don't know of any that do not borrow others ideas (and sometimes code pieces/fragments/ideas) to make their own.

    This is the nature of computers and software. One plants and another waters. Software is NEVER finished (hahaha)

  8. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by keatonec View Post

    plus the people who develop apps and programs for anyone, aren't they hackers to. i mean they code and everything just like "hackers". Right? i mean i could be wrong. i don't know much about this stuff but thats the way i look at things.
    No, not really. That's like comparing a wild game hunter to a serial killer... I mean they both shoot at and kill things right?
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    I once prayed to God for an iPhone, but quickly found out He didn't work that way...so I stole an iPhone and prayed for His forgiveness.

    A dog is the only thing on earth that loves you more than you love yourself. - Josh Billings

  9. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mes View Post
    Great point . You know, I've lived in several engineering departments over the years. I don't know of any that do not borrow others ideas (and sometimes code pieces/fragments/ideas) to make their own.

    This is the nature of computers and software. One plants and another waters. Software is NEVER finished (hahaha)
    exactly. like i said before everyone is just advancing the technology. the only reason apple is pissed about it is because they arent making a profit off of it. but thats the soceity we live in. everyone is out for themselves and to make as much money as possible. kind of sad.

    Quote Originally Posted by sziklassy View Post
    No, not really. That's like comparing a wild game hunter to a serial killer... I mean they both shoot at and kill things right?
    not really. the only way that would be true is if the hackers were actually breaking into things and destroying things or the people who have sent viruses around to shut down websites. that would be like comparing a game hunter to a serial killer.

    im more talking about a game hunter who hunts for fun, and someone who does it to sell the meat after and make a profit after. i dont know if that makes much sense but it was the only thing i could think of.
    Last edited by keatonec; 2009-02-21 at 04:48 AM. Reason: Automerged Doublepost

  10. #50
    i for one am going to work around all of this and join in with saurik musclenerd and others to develop iphone linux

    that way we dont have to abide by anyones rules,,, we will have a completely open source iphone os so we can do what we want when we want... especially if apple wins they're fight against jailbreaking

    i will post a link to my thread about how you can get involved here once i find out more as to they're progress ect

  11. #51
    Sounds great. looking forward to contributing, Good luck

  12. #52
    Livin the iPhone Life Eurisko's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by keatonec View Post
    what i find funny is that apple doesn't want people to "hack" the iphone, but the people who founded the company to begin with, they were hackers when they first started out weren't they?
    The one major point you seem to be missing is, they didn't "hack" other peoples work to get where they are.

    Quote Originally Posted by him121213 View Post
    i for one am going to work around all of this and join in with saurik musclenerd and others to develop iphone linux
    Interesting concept, and how exactly do you plan to install iPhone Linux without affecting the current OS and again breaking the DMCA?
    Last edited by Eurisko; 2009-02-21 at 03:55 PM. Reason: Automerged Doublepost
    Get "iPod & iTunes for Dummies", it'll change your life.

  13. #53
    Quote Originally Posted by Eurisko View Post
    And again the confusion continues, or some people don't read before responding. Apple does not make law, they have declared jailbreaking illegal because under the DMCA, it is. Apple didn't make the DMCA, they are simply trying to enforce it.

    We should test every law? Sound good, I'm going to pop off and murder my landlord. I can always use the excuse, I just wanted to test if I'd be arrested. I'm sure they'll let me go. Laws are made because the law makers know they are going to be broken, and then the punishment can justifiably be applied.
    Yes here in America, it has to go to a court of law before it can be enforced. It is how we determine that a law is LEGAL in the first place. You cant just jump up and say something is illegal and have it be so. Without educating you too much as to how the U.S legal system works, there are generally 3 types of law: federal, state and local.

    Apple is in california, i am in pennsylvania, they cant just say that what i am doing is illegal unless they take their claim to a federal court and the federal court acknowledges it.

    Popping of your landlord, well unless you were the first person to do so in CANADA, i would assume that you would be the the person who the law is tested with.

    However i am unfamiliar with Canadian laws, nor would i presume to know anything about them. But thats how its done here.

    Quote Originally Posted by Eurisko View Post
    The one major point you seem to be missing is, they didn't "hack" other peoples work to get where they are.
    No they just blatently ripped off xerox.

    And yes they were all hackers in some way or another. They made blueboxes, and cracked open altairs, Even Steve Wozniak admits that one of his main forms of amusement was hacking various things.



    Quote Originally Posted by Eurisko View Post
    Interesting concept, and how exactly do you plan to install iPhone Linux without affecting the current OS and again breaking the DMCA?
    Well.. If i had to think about it, jailbreaking is currently the only method being used, that doesnt mean it is the only method possible.

    I would guess that like rockbox or ipod linux, it would just be a matter of bypassing the default os and loading whatever it is that you wanted.

    Its a computer, you can do whatever it is that you want with it, all someone needs to do is figure out how.

    Quote Originally Posted by romo View Post
    What DMCA stand for ? BTW 20 , 50 or even $100 US i would donate, i learn alot from here...
    Digital Millenium Copyright Act.

    It is an American Law that is not applicable anywhere else other then America.

    Quote Originally Posted by sziklassy View Post
    The idea of being able to do what you want with YOUR device has been around much longer than many think. Modding video game consoles to play homebrew (and yes most people mod to play pirated games in the video games scene anyway) has been taken away from consumers since home consoles were around, for the most part. Seeing as how they are able to get away with busting people for modchips or software mods of video games, I assume Apple will be able to take this to an equally high level and do the same. That being said, these companies rarely (if ever) go after the 20 year old college kid installing a mod chip in their Xbox. not to say that Apple won;t do that, but they have bigger fish to fry (like all the repos pumping out all the pirated games/apps(. The sad thing is, that most people who pirate stuff probably wouldn't even buy the app/game in the first place, so they are really not generating revenue by "forcing" people to buy because, well, they would rather just go without than pay for the damn thing.
    You are right, however that is only partially true.

    Modding a system like an Xbox is a state by state thing. It's not illegal in all states.

    And yeah, there was a big raid about a year ago because people were selling mod chips out of their garage, which again is another reason I prefer the softmod method.

    My main reason for softmodding my xbox was because of XBMC. I have a 1tb NAS, and I wanted someway to watch my movies and TV shows on my Television.

    Which is not to say that I haven't downed a game or two, but then again these games are no longer being produced.

    Which brings up a real interesting loophole here, that I want to share with all of you regarding that:

    Legal Downloading Terms
    Last edited by boe_dye; 2009-02-21 at 05:12 PM. Reason: Automerged Doublepost
    Herp a derp a derp a doooo!

  14. #54
    Livin the iPhone Life Eurisko's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by boe_dye View Post
    Yes here in America, it has to go to a court of law before it can be enforced. It is how we determine that a law is LEGAL in the first place. You cant just jump up and say something is illegal and have it be so. Without educating you too much as to how the U.S legal system works, there are generally 3 types of law: federal, state and local.
    So what you're saying is, a Law doesn't become a Law until its challenged? And you're saying this seriously? Because in the US, a Law becomes a Law when its passed in Senate.

    Quote Originally Posted by boe_dye View Post
    No they just blatently ripped off xerox.
    Actually Steve publicly gave full props to Xerox for their innovation. If you want to view that as a blatant rip-off, you've got issues. And lastly, what Apple did not do is hack Xerox's OS to use it to their own advantage. If you don't see the distinction, again, issues.

    But, this is going nowhere. Put whatever spin on it you want. It will finally be decided in the courts and they will sort it out.
    Get "iPod & iTunes for Dummies", it'll change your life.

  15. #55
    Quote Originally Posted by Eurisko View Post
    Interesting concept, and how exactly do you plan to install iPhone Linux without affecting the current OS and again breaking the DMCA?
    right now in development we depend on jailbreaking to use it and install it but eventually once we get a stable working version of it running we will find other means to install on the phone

    just like we found a way to upload our own custom firmwares before.. we will write a program that will install it on the iphone

  16. #56
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eurisko View Post
    So what you're saying is, a Law doesn't become a Law until its challenged? And you're saying this seriously? Because in the US, a Law becomes a Law when its passed in Senate.
    "A Law doesn't become a Law until its challenged?" Not saying this at all. But there IS an important difference created by our founding fathers that sooooo many people overlook.

    Laws are supposed to be created by us (via elected officials), for the common good of all. Politicians are proxies for the people --- nothing more!! As everyone is aware, politicians (especially at the local level) frequently step-outside the US and/or state constitutions and create unjust, unfair, and/or downright greedy self-interest laws. They also create laws the majority do not agree with.

    The judicial branch was created to give everybody (including the average joe) an opportunity to challenge laws created by elected politicians. In some ways, this is the most important branch of our government. As some might say ... The buck stops here

    It's 'We The People" 's right (and duty) to challenge and keep our politicians honest and doing the 'will of the people'. Remember...... they work for us!! Our country was founded By and For the People (not for the politicians, or supreme leader, or, or... )

    Remaining silent is the absolute worst thing free people in a free nation can do. Silence implies acceptance. When our elected official step out-of-line, we can and should use all means available (including the courts) to remedy it.

    This is true Democracy at work. The will of the people MUST prevail.

    Oh BTW: A law does NOT become law when passed by the Senate. A federal law must be passed by the House and Senate, then signed by the President. The only exception, with a 2/3 majority in both the House and the Senate, no Presidential approval/signing is required.
    Last edited by Mes; 2009-02-21 at 09:43 PM.

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  18. #57
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    ^^^ that was great. its to bad that our society isnt actually like that. Politicians still do what ever they are told by the people who are signing their checks. which as much as we would like to think that its us, it isnt. its big corrupt corporations that want to make as much money as possible and they dont give a damn who they have to run over to get it. Thats why so many politicians end up working for huge companies, is because they helped get a law passed or something and the company then hooks them up big time. kind of sad if you think about how greedy everyone is. well i shouldnt say everyone is greedy. allot of people are, but not everyone.

  19. #58
    iPhone? More like MyPhone compton,Tx's Avatar
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    What are you talking about? Before you team with Saurik, Musclenerd, and other Dev team members you should come up with a better handle than "Him121213." Please cease and desist this nonsense.


    Wait, Bam! Is that You?

  20. #59
    ehh!! for your info i have already conversed with them on multiple occasions and i in fact like the band

  21. #60
    Quote Originally Posted by compton,Tx View Post
    What are you talking about? Before you team with Saurik, Musclenerd, and other Dev team members you should come up with a better handle than "Him121213." Please cease and desist this nonsense.


    Wait, Bam! Is that You?
    Says the person who's only intelligent response to an intelligent conversation is "change your user name cause it's not cool enough?"

    Yes, "Compton, TX" is so original, so hip, so cool, so innovative. I can hardly wonder how you were ever so clever to come up with that one.
    Herp a derp a derp a doooo!

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