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Thread: Apple Looking to Dismiss a Lawsuit Over Allegations of "Misleading" iOS Device Capacity

  1. #1
    What's Jailbreak? Akshay Masand's Avatar
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    Default Apple Looking to Dismiss a Lawsuit Over Allegations of "Misleading" iOS Device Capacity


    This past week, Apple filed a motion to dismiss a class action lawsuit that claimed the company misrepresented the amount of storage space iOS 8 uses in newly shipped iPhone and iPad devices, noting plaintiffs failed to provide evidence of fraud. According to Apple’s California court filing, plaintiffs Paul Orshan and Christopher Endara didn’t present facts supporting claims that the iPhone and iPad buyers were intentionally misled about the amount of usable disk space on new device that were running iOS 8. The Cupertino California company ended up being slapped with the lawsuit in December, where the company said the following:

    Like all software ever written, Apple's iOS mobile operating system—which enables the device to function—uses a portion of a device's resources, including its storage capacity.
    Plaintiffs argued that they knew iOS 8 would eat some disks pace but it was larger than expected. They weren’t able to “reasonably anticipate” the size of iOS 8 as compared to previous versions of Apple’s mobile operating system according to the filing. The suit also claims that Apple purposely used low device capacity to sell customers subscription-based iCloud storage plans.

    In its motion to dismiss, Apple claimed that the argument suffers from two fundamental flaws. The first being the plaintiffs’ inability to produce evidential statements from Apple or other sources that would have led them to such expectations. Secondly, plaintiffs failed to mention the cited subscription iCloud storage plans only apply to upgraded service options. Apple does offer 5 GB of free iCloud storage space with every new device purchase which is more than enough to cover the “alleged” large size of iOS 8.

    Furthermore, Apple noted that plaintiffs only purchased 16 GB versions of the iPhone 5S and iPhone 6 as well as an unidentified iPad model but are suing over the 8 GB and 16 GB iPhone, iPad and iPod products. Therefore, plaintiffs lack the standing when it comes to asserting their complaint. Overall, Apple ended up requesting the suit be dismissed with prejudice.

    We’ll have to wait and see what ends up happening.

    Source: Scribd via AppleInsider

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  3. #2
    I mean in a perfect world our devices would have exactly 16 GB of available space the first time we power them up. People have to realize that if you want more features, it's going to take up more space. Heck, I think apple even has a disclaimer at the bottom of the page of their device overviews.

  4. #3
    Like the other mobile manufacturing companies...

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  6. #4
    Well companies like apple should forget 16gb storage now. Expensive products with such low storage is a shame. Instead of removing 32gb, they should have removed 16gb from the list. Apple software takes a lot of space, so they should provide enough storage. It shouldn't hurt them by having 32gb in place of 16gb and not changing the price.

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  8. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by PaKi619 View Post
    Well companies like apple should forget 16gb storage now. Expensive products with such low storage is a shame. Instead of removing 32gb, they should have removed 16gb from the list. Apple software takes a lot of space, so they should provide enough storage. It shouldn't hurt them by having 32gb in place of 16gb and not changing the price.
    The only reason they got rid of 32gb was to incentivize customers to go to 64gb and I wouldn't be surprised if that's worked out really well for them so far. Remember when Apple made a big deal of going from 8gb to 16gb? If we're lucky, they'll change the storage options on the next generation of devices. Especially with iPads because 16gb on an iPad is just dreadful.

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  10. #6
    Livin the iPhone Life vinaygoel2000's Avatar
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    Samsung S6 takes up 9 GB and HTC M9 takes up 12 GB out of the box. Are they included in the lawsuit?

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  12. #7
    What I would like to know can't companies like Apple or anyone else just setup the partitions so that the data partition is actually the advertised size?

    Yes the flash would need to be slightly larger (such as 20-25 GB total for a 16 device so the OS has the space it needs in the system partition while the data partition would be ~16 GB [~16 billion bytes] as advertised.)

    The cost for the extra 5-10 GB would be negotiable considering how cheap flash has gotten so really there is little to no good reason not to do something like this that I can presently think of.

  13. #8
    "The suit also claims that Apple purposely used low device capacity to sell customers subscription-based iCloud storage plans."

    That, and flash memory modules are cheap but Apple makes an incredible profit selling a 64GB as compared to only 16GB.

    A 16GB iPhone and a 64GB phone costs almost exactly the same to manufacture.

  14. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by szr View Post
    What I would like to know can't companies like Apple or anyone else just setup the partitions so that the data partition is actually the advertised size?

    Yes the flash would need to be slightly larger (such as 20-25 GB total for a 16 device so the OS has the space it needs in the system partition while the data partition would be ~16 GB [~16 billion bytes] as advertised.)

    The cost for the extra 5-10 GB would be negotiable considering how cheap flash has gotten so really there is little to no good reason not to do something like this that I can presently think of.
    Even if it costs 1 dollar more that is many millions of dollars.

  15. #10
    Green Apple bewie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by szr View Post
    What I would like to know can't companies like Apple or anyone else just setup the partitions so that the data partition is actually the advertised size?

    Yes the flash would need to be slightly larger (such as 20-25 GB total for a 16 device so the OS has the space it needs in the system partition while the data partition would be ~16 GB [~16 billion bytes] as advertised.)

    The cost for the extra 5-10 GB would be negotiable considering how cheap flash has gotten so really there is little to no good reason not to do something like this that I can presently think of.
    I'm guessing the main reason nobody is doing this is that every flash memory chip size out there is a power of 2 (2Gb, 4Gb, 8Gb, you know how it goes). Doing as you suggest would require either putting an extra flash chip dedicated to system files in the device - which is obviously not an option in a really tight-fit device like the iPhone - or using a chip that's double the advertised size. Both of these would lead to more expensive devices to cover the cost of the extra storage.
    Last edited by bewie; 2015-03-29 at 10:45 AM.
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  16. #11
    Last I've seen any other company takes a crap ton of capacity to install their OS. I mean everything is always rounded over. Every vehicle you drive gets a total mpg but you never get exact mpg it's just an averaged estimate. Look at the surface pro

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  18. #12
    I do think this is a serious problem. When I upgraded from 64gb 5 to 64gb 5S, the new device had even less total available capacity than the old one. Only slightly less. But each device fresh out of the box had over 9gb of unusable space! Is it a manufacturing problem? Surely the OS isnt 5+ gigs.

    I couldn't wait to get my 128gb iphone, because I do actually use that space. Or, should I say, 114gb iphone - what the **** uses 14gb right out of the box????!

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  20. #13
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    Well, there's two issues at play here.

    First is measurement of 'what is a gigabyte?' When Apple advertises the 16GB version, they mean that it has 16,000,000,000 bytes; all hardware manufacturers advertise like this. However, the actual definition of a gigabyte as processed by computer software is 1,073,741,824 bytes - that is, 1024*1024*1024 - because a kilobyte is 1024 bytes, a megabyte is 1024 kilobytes, and a gigabyte is 1024 megabytes. So this means an iPhone advertised at 16GB by Apple is only seen as 14.9GB by the software; 64GB is actually 59.6GB, and 128GB is actually 119.2GB. Again, though, this is industry standard and all hard drive and digital storage mediums advertise this way.

    Secondly is the size of the software itself. It would be very stupid of Apple to try to partition extra storage out for the iOS. If it's on a separate component, that means more room needed in the casing and on the motherboard, means larger or thicker phones, and also it will have a power draw that, even if very low, will drain the battery faster. If it's on the same hardware component, partitioning still comes at a cost - it limits what Apple can add to the device if that partition is too small, and if it's too large, it's wasted space and cost. Every computer since the beginning of PCs has come with an OS pre-installed that takes up some of the advertised disk space. It's understood that with each software upgrade that more features are added and therefore additional space is generally taken up.

    At the end of the day, things are exactly as they should be, and this is just a nuisance complaint. These plantiffs should be fined by the courts and made to pay Apple's legal fees for wasting everyone's time.

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  22. #14
    Just got a 64gb iPhone 6 - really loving the extra space. Had a 5s 16gb which was full in no time. And I kinda just took it for granted that the OS will take up a certain amount of space. The problem
    Being that each iteration of the OS will take up more or less room. Look at the iTunes downloads now, 11 was approx 90mb, I think 12 is approx 150mb (someone correct me on this) so it would be hard for them to predict the actual amount of user space. And if you jailbreak I think this may be affected too?

  23. #15
    32gb is all i need , life, money , phone, and sex is all good.

  24. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by mwhite67 View Post
    Even if it costs 1 dollar more that is many millions of dollars.
    At bulk rates it wouldn't even be near that. That's assuming the cost would be any different at all, especially considering how much flash memory prices have gone down. You can get 128 GB for what 32 used to go for maybe three years ago.

  25. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by PCYoda View Post
    Secondly is the size of the software itself. It would be very stupid of Apple to try to partition extra storage out for the iOS. If it's on a separate component, that means more room needed in the casing and on the motherboard, means larger or thicker phones, and also it will have a power draw that, even if very low, will drain the battery faster. If it's on the same hardware component, partitioning still comes at a cost - it limits what Apple can add to the device if that partition is too small, and if it's too large, it's wasted space and cost. Every computer since the beginning of PCs has come with an OS pre-installed that takes up some of the advertised disk space. It's understood that with each software upgrade that more features are added and therefore additional space is generally taken up.
    What some people don't seem to understand, though, is that iOS already has two partitions, one for the system/OS, and the other for user/data. The size of partitions is preset within each IPSW package.

    Secondly, the system partition doesn't need to be much larger than the initial system install size, since everything a user downloads goes into the data partition, so the system partition really doesn't experience much growth, unless you're jail-broken (Cydia installs most things to the system partition initially though prefs and such are still typically on the data side.)

  26. #18
    @PCYoda: The problem isn't the GiB (factors of 1,024) vs GB (factors of 1,000) but rather the issue is larger capacity could be used at virtually no extra cost to ensure that the data partitions more closely matched their advertised size. Yes, I know most things are advertised based on the max capacity of the entire storage media/drive/etc, and normally using the 1,000 (where 64GB == ~64,000,000,000), which is fine and dandy. It's simply a matter of companies like Apples still pretending that 16GB flash is costing them any different than 128GB, especially at mass bulk rates that they enjoy.

    Apple has always claimed to be about pushing change and such, so why not push a change there an advertised storage capacity actually is about the capacity available to the user. Especially (but not limited to) given that the iDevices have no external storage options what so ever.

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  28. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by PaKi619 View Post
    Well companies like apple should forget 16gb storage now. Expensive products with such low storage is a shame. Instead of removing 32gb, they should have removed 16gb from the list. Apple software takes a lot of space, so they should provide enough storage. It shouldn't hurt them by having 32gb in place of 16gb and not changing the price.
    Exactly!

    I think the biggest problem is that, generally, apple REQUIRES you to update to a firmware that requires more data to be given up by the user. I know iOS will take x amount of data, and if I could put whatever iOS version I wanted, then I could control how much data I give apple. If you ever have to do a restore, you're at apple's mercy.

  29. #20
    This lawsuit is stupid.

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