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Thread: [LEAKING] To those who find it acceptable...

  1. #101
    Quote Originally Posted by santaf View Post
    Except it's not the average joe who is going to places like the x-website and the sin one to download themes that are popular and all of which are actually made from scratch so again that doesn't make sense that because others are stealing from other themers or creating really small themes and selling them for 2 bucks , that people would start to pirate the themes, because they are only pirating the themes actually worth the money. Yes there are those people who do not understand download size, and what not but I would say the majority knows what themes are popular out there especially if they have ever been to modmyi since all that gets talked about are the themes that are worth the money, or themes that are actually free.

    And screenshots if it is a complete theme that is worth the money there will be a bunch of screenshots that proves it instead of just one screen shot
    The average Joe is often the guy googling now for those free themes - or at least goes onto doing so, since they're not going to see value in buying the themes to begin with. I mean, the average Joe equates jailbreaking with piracy, from what I've seen. Plus they're not usually the people who see value in spending $1-2 on a theme, especially not if they can get them free... or else they go that route after being ripped off by one of the above vendors who I've named.

    While pirating the good themes is popular, the leakers seem to love sharing the crap themes, since they don't see any value in them either... and honestly, I'm having problems blaming them for that one. I've been ripped off once or twice myself, with the 'no updates' situation, or at least I feel that way.

  2. #102
    Santa Claus, Theme Creator santaf's Avatar
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    haha you got more than finishing these themes to do K haha But a theme section would be awesome, and I always wondered what makes a theme go in featured sections of rock and cydia haha. I guess you just gotta have started early int he theme making, and be popular haha.

    Quote Originally Posted by Jarlath View Post
    The average Joe is often the guy googling now for those free themes - or at least goes onto doing so, since they're not going to see value in buying the themes to begin with. I mean, the average Joe equates jailbreaking with piracy, from what I've seen. Plus they're not usually the people who see value in spending $1-2 on a theme, especially not if they can get them free... or else they go that route after being ripped off by one of the above vendors who I've named.

    While pirating the good themes is popular, the leakers seem to love sharing the crap themes, since they don't see any value in them either... and honestly, I'm having problems blaming them for that one. I've been ripped off once or twice myself, with the 'no updates' situation, or at least I feel that way.
    agreed bout leaking the half arsed themes there is no point to them, and shouldn't be sold to begin with but I feel like this whole thing is about leaking the themes that are worth the 1-2 bucks. I wouldn't call them the average joe though that goes to these sites, I believe the average joe doesn't know about these sites, and really even about cracking themes or apps. I'm not sure what to call them though hah. But there certainly are those who get a cracked version but then go and buy the real one, I've had people do that to my themes, and actually paid me more than I asked for them. I have learned to live with it, and I know it's not going to stop now when I see my theme on a website I just ask for credit and for the original poster to ask users to pay for the theme if they like it. I know what you mean about being ripped off that does suck man. I am sorry.

    In the end haha I'm pretty sure we are on the same side here haha

  3. #103
    Theme Kingpin TCcentex's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jarlath View Post
    The average Joe is often the guy googling now for those free themes - or at least goes onto doing so, since they're not going to see value in buying the themes to begin with. I mean, the average Joe equates jailbreaking with piracy, from what I've seen. Plus they're not usually the people who see value in spending $1-2 on a theme, especially not if they can get them free... or else they go that route after being ripped off by one of the above vendors who I've named.

    While pirating the good themes is popular, the leakers seem to love sharing the crap themes, since they don't see any value in them either... and honestly, I'm having problems blaming them for that one. I've been ripped off once or twice myself, with the 'no updates' situation, or at least I feel that way.
    Man, your expectations are WAY too high. Sounds like you want perfection and a lifetime of service for $2. Welcome to the real world -- we get ripped off everyday buying spoiled fruit that we don't find out about until we get home and take a big bite, a pair of shoes that looked great in the store but give you blazing blisters -- there's a very popular saying "BUYER BEWARE" -- if you've bought a bunch of copy and paste themes, that's on you -- do better research and learn from your mistakes. Don't get me wrong bro -- I'm not trying to be a jerk, I just think you can apply your argument to virtually any goods or services for sale. That's just a part of life, people with no honor love to have a dollar, and when they get the first one they won't stop until they can get another, and another... I gotta go -- a Prince from Nigeria just emailed me and wants me to help him get his inheritance and he's going to cut me in!!

    Oh yeah -- the Mod over at X-Mart gave me an infraction for editing my tyraid posts with "..." (as you know you can't delete a post once it's on the forum, and I felt bad after posting all my "you are all thieves" stuff) -- that's incredible to me. You can do all the other stuff they allow and encourage but put a few dots on a posting and you're infraction material. I love MMi

    Oh, and K.Nitsua -- you are VERY well spoken for a 24-year old -- everything you said was right on point. I'd like to add the fact that a lot of themers do all that you listed with a spouse and a couple kids thrown in the mix... hell, Bars has to put a picture of his wife and kids in his sig just so he doesn't forget what they look like with all those hours theming in the basement for God sake!!
    Last edited by TCcentex; 2010-05-21 at 04:41 AM. Reason: Automerged Doublepost

  4. #104
    Quote Originally Posted by santaf View Post
    agreed bout leaking the half arsed themes there is no point to them, and shouldn't be sold to begin with but I feel like this whole thing is about leaking the themes that are worth the 1-2 bucks. I wouldn't call them the average joe though that goes to these sites, I believe the average joe doesn't know about these sites, and really even about cracking themes or apps. I'm not sure what to call them though hah. But there certainly are those who get a cracked version but then go and buy the real one, I've had people do that to my themes, and actually paid me more than I asked for them. I have learned to live with it, and I know it's not going to stop now when I see my theme on a website I just ask for credit and for the original poster to ask users to pay for the theme if they like it. I know what you mean about being ripped off that does suck man. I am sorry.

    In the end haha I'm pretty sure we are on the same side here haha
    Pretty much - like k.nitsua said, it's pretty much impossible to stop the themes from going out there to begin with, but jailbreaking = piracy in every situation where I've talked with someone who doesn't hang out on forums like these whenever it comes up in conversation. Heck, even in other sections of some places, I keep running into questions about how to pirate software once they've jailbroken.

    It comes down to value-add in the end... and a lot of themes don't value-add.

    Quote Originally Posted by TCcentex View Post
    Man, your expectations are WAY too high. Sounds like you want perfection and a lifetime of service for $2. Welcome to the real world -- we get ripped off everyday buying spoiled fruit that we don't find out about until we get home and take a big bite, a pair of shoes that looked great in the store but give you blazing blisters -- there's a very popular saying "BUYER BEWARE" -- if you've bought a bunch of copy and paste themes, that's on you -- do better research and learn from your mistakes.

    Oh yeah -- the Mod over at X-Mart gave me an infraction for editing my tyraid posts with "..." (as you know you can't delete a post once it's on the forum, and I felt bad after posting all my "you are all thieves" stuff) -- that's incredible to me. You can do all the other stuff they allow and encourage but put a few dots on a posting and you're infraction material. I love MMi
    TCCentex: I don't expect a lifetime's service, but I do expect that if I'm shelling out $2.00, that the theme at least be more than icons and wallpaper, especially these days. In the days of Customize and SummerBoard, it was all about the icons and the wallpaper, but WinterBoard opened up new vistas for skinning, and I like it when themes take advantage of these, or at least 50-60% of these (as many buttons as possible, maybe the button bar).

    And, at least at the store, I get to inspect my fruit before I buy it - so the chances of me getting 'ripped off' buying spoiled fruit is low. And I didn't even buy copy-paste themes, but ones whose names I won't mention here (I don't want to libel), but which promised biweekly updates and which never received any as they went onto creating other themes while leaving their earlier efforts half-complete and abandoned. At least with GT and iElegance Pro and most of my other theme purchases there were icon threads so I could get the icons I was missing, and free themes like Glasklart and iLlumine get regular updates by dedicated icon-makers and theme-maintainers.

    Maybe I've been spoiled by people like Bars and Toyvan who actually take the time to update their themes, or at least leave the PSD files out there for other people to create their own icons, or who actually add things to them which have been requested (I remember when GOC Pro didn't have AppIconMask files, or custom UISound files). But when I look for 'value-add' in a theme, they and the k.nitsua/zausser combo are usually the people I look towards, along with many of the golds who posted in this thread.

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  6. #105
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jarlath View Post
    Pretty much - like k.nitsua said, it's pretty much impossible to stop the themes from going out there to begin with, but jailbreaking = piracy in every situation where I've talked with someone who doesn't hang out on forums like these whenever it comes up in conversation. Heck, even in other sections of some places, I keep running into questions about how to pirate software once they've jailbroken.

    It comes down to value-add in the end... and a lot of themes don't value-add.



    TCCentex: I don't expect a lifetime's service, but I do expect that if I'm shelling out $2.00, that the theme at least be more than icons and wallpaper, especially these days. In the days of Customize and SummerBoard, it was all about the icons and the wallpaper, but WinterBoard opened up new vistas for skinning, and I like it when themes take advantage of these, or at least 50-60% of these (as many buttons as possible, maybe the button bar).

    And, at least at the store, I get to inspect my fruit before I buy it - so the chances of me getting 'ripped off' buying spoiled fruit is low. And I didn't even buy copy-paste themes, but ones whose names I won't mention here (I don't want to libel), but which promised biweekly updates and which never received any as they went onto creating other themes while leaving their earlier efforts half-complete and abandoned. At least with GT and iElegance Pro and most of my other theme purchases there were icon threads so I could get the icons I was missing, and free themes like Glasklart and iLlumine get regular updates by dedicated icon-makers and theme-maintainers.

    Maybe I've been spoiled by people like Bars and Toyvan who actually take the time to update their themes, or at least leave the PSD files out there for other people to create their own icons, or who actually add things to them which have been requested (I remember when GOC Pro didn't have AppIconMask files, or custom UISound files). But when I look for 'value-add' in a theme, they and the k.nitsua/zausser combo are usually the people I look towards, along with many of the golds who posted in this thread.
    I get what you're saying my friend -- hope you didn't take any offense to my response. The Uber-Themers you mentioned have set the bar where it needs to be, and I'm going to do my part to continue to get better at the craft they've mastered so I can at least see that bar, which is hardly visible from where I'm currently positioned

  7. #106
    "The Chuck Bass of Theming" k.nitsua's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TCcentex View Post
    Oh, and K.Nitsua -- you are VERY well spoken for a 24-year old -- everything you said was right on point. I'd like to add the fact that a lot of themers do all that you listed with a spouse and a couple kids thrown in the mix... hell, Bars has to put a picture of his wife and kids in his sig just so he'll feel like he's not apart from them all those hours theming in the basement for God sake!!
    What do you mean for a 24-year-old? Lol. I feel old, to be perfectly honest.

    I do feel like we need to do something in regards to not only battling the piracy issue, but the issue of the junk that has run rampant on Cydia. Lite versions are good ideas - maybe guidelines of what constitutes "Lite" versions.

    This "24-year-old" has inadvertently taken this issue as his own. I will do some research on the matter and propose several ideas for themers and even for MMi. These will just be suggestions.

    To be completely honest, I wish I could release my themes for free. I wish everyone can enjoy them and I honestly like the hear the praise. Before, the praise from the community was enough.

    But as stated before, these themes take up so much time... weeks for the most part. Most themes are made by ONE person. Most community projects (open source projects, etc.) are done by a group of individuals and it takes months for a complete project. The demand for completeness, speed, uniqueness, and support puts iPhone themes on a different level than most "theme" projects.

    And honestly guys, it's not like we make bank on these themes. We don't. We make enough to warrant our habit, and to justify it to our families and significant others. My hat goes off to Z, Bars, and others who have families and are able to balance this stuff out.

    Maybe when I get my MD, I can justify doing all this stuff for free. Until then, "can you spare some change?"... lol.
    #eli7e revived me

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  9. #107
    Wow, I felt like I just read a book Lot of good points here, but seems like just a place to vent. Now my 2 cents. If there is a way for someone to get something for free, instead of paying any kind of money for it they will. That's human nature. For me making themes is my hobby, something I like to do and enjoy doing. I love to hear people's excitement when they are able to put a theme I created, on there phone and truly enjoy it. This is what will keep me making themes. Its not about the money, for me its more about the thanks I get for creating something someone else couldn't or didn't have the resource to do so. As for marteen I don't like your decision to quit your theme, just cause someone pirated it. If it was something you really enjoyed doing then it really wouldn't have mattered. Its like if you like to play golf and someone steals your golf clubs. Would you quit playing golf? No you would go buy some more. So if it is truly what you enjoy doing keep it up, walk away throwing deuces

  10. #108
    Santa Claus, Theme Creator santaf's Avatar
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    I'd quit golf haha just kidding. I agree but he said he is gonna pick it up again. I think he just got mad really fast about it, and like he said he was looking for an excuse to stop the theme, because he already wanted to stop making it for other reasons but hopefully he does come back to making it.

    K 24 isn't old sorry buddy haha just a bit older than I but still not so old haha. :P

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  12. #109
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    Quote Originally Posted by k.nitsua View Post
    What do you mean for a 24-year-old? Lol. I feel old, to be perfectly honest.

    I do feel like we need to do something in regards to not only battling the piracy issue, but the issue of the junk that has run rampant on Cydia. Lite versions are good ideas - maybe guidelines of what constitutes "Lite" versions.

    This "24-year-old" has inadvertently taken this issue as his own. I will do some research on the matter and propose several ideas for themers and even for MMi. These will just be suggestions.

    To be completely honest, I wish I could release my themes for free. I wish everyone can enjoy them and I honestly like the hear the praise. Before, the praise from the community was enough.

    But as stated before, these themes take up so much time... weeks for the most part. Most themes are made by ONE person. Most community projects (open source projects, etc.) are done by a group of individuals and it takes months for a complete project. The demand for completeness, speed, uniqueness, and support puts iPhone themes on a different level than most "theme" projects.

    And honestly guys, it's not like we make bank on these themes. We don't. We make enough to warrant our habit, and to justify it to our families and significant others. My hat goes off to Z, Bars, and others who have families and are able to balance this stuff out.

    Maybe when I get my MD, I can justify doing all this stuff for free. Until then, "can you spare some change?"... lol.
    LOL -- I meant no disrespect my friend, I'm just extremely impressed that someone as young as you are is so well-spoken. I'm a couple years away from 40 and most people my age that I deal with day to day couldn't string two words together to save their lives. And I just finished my first theme thinking that it had to be a breeze only to find out how freaking tedious and time consuming it is -- I wouldn't allow myself to release something with my name on it that didn't at least come somewhere close to what you guys are capable of. And I did a complete theme - sounds, every image, from scratch -- I learned very quickly that what you guys do is the farthest thing from a simple hobby.

  13. #110
    you know the sad thing about all this! we buy apps from the apple app store for 2 bucks or more all the time. and i like most people might only use it once in a blue moon then trash it. a theme for 2-3 bucks and its something that you use every time you unlock your phone. all i can say is that if themes were on apples app store im sure they would be selling for alot more than what themers do right now. just food for thought

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  15. #111
    Quote Originally Posted by TCcentex View Post
    I get what you're saying my friend -- hope you didn't take any offense to my response. The Uber-Themers you mentioned have set the bar where it needs to be, and I'm going to do my part to continue to get better at the craft they've mastered so I can at least see that bar, which is hardly visible from where I'm currently positioned
    No offense taken - I guess I'm one of the people who remember first getting an iPod Touch and then seeing what SummerBoard by NullRiver did and thinking 'so someone did something that Apple couldn't figure out, even though they've been doing theming on Windows Mobile (aka CE) for years' and then wanting to get an iPod just to theme. Heck, I remember when Customize was fresh-spanking new and the controversy around Customize 2.0 when they had online storage for themes and a 'premium' option to allow you priority access to the servers (which didn't work very well).

    I remember when the Cydia Store was new, and how some people tried selling themes before it was out, like the aforementioned Winterboarder, who sold a button set (Aluminum) but offered free themes as well. And when Bars decided to sell his enhanced version of i'Elegance, it was probably one of the first themes out there that was both fairly complete (not as complete as Stickers at that time, but Danimator was a theming machine and built on Mantia's lovely icons), it was worth buying, but newer themes skinned more and were better ones, IMO.

    But these days? It's kinda hard to get enthused over themes, especially with that asshat velind shoving out 50 lockscreen-only 'themes' every day that I can't filter out short of removing crucial Community-installed sources... so you can understand why I have strong feelings on the 'sold C&P' themes which are now all the rage, and which are causing a very high noise-to-signal ratio in Cydia. When almost any chance you have of buying a theme ends up showing you 10-20 pages of crap to get ONE decent theme... well, I can understand why some people will frequent those other forums to find their themes.

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  17. #112
    Theme Kingpin TCcentex's Avatar
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    i say we all chip-in our theming skills and release a collaborated theme named "iSlap" -- if it is pirated and installed on a device that does not validate a license showing it was purchased, a hand with very large, heavy rings on each finger pops out of the screen and slaps the user in the face

    I'm spent -- this has been a crazy day and I'm going to bed -- thanks everyone for such a wonderful forum of ideas and opinions. Let's get that creator's convention in Vegas going and get rip-roaring drunk and throw our iPhones into the pool in front of the Bellagio

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  19. #113

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  21. #114
    "The Chuck Bass of Theming" k.nitsua's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TCcentex View Post
    i say we all chip-in our theming skills and release a collaborated theme named "iSlap" -- if it is pirated and installed on a device that does not validate a license showing it was purchased, a hand with very large, heavy rings on each finger pops out of the screen and slaps the user in the face

    I'm spent -- this has been a crazy day and I'm going to bed -- thanks everyone for such a wonderful forum of ideas and opinions. Let's get that creator's convention in Vegas going and get rip-roaring drunk and throw our iPhones into the pool in front of the Bellagio
    I'm game. I was supposed to be in Vegas this summer anyways for the World Series of Poker, but I didn't make enough money before the deadline of the circuit I wanted to get it. Ah well, there's always next year.

    And as far as myself being well versed... my initial major out of high school was Literature and Cultural Arts. I wanted to be a writer... then I realized the jobs behind that major was almost exclusive to jobs that... well... helped people get their Literature and Cultural Arts majors - mainly English teachers.

    So I switched the medical field. Now I'm well versed and can decipher between streptococcus aureus and staphylococcus haemolyticus, lol.

    ... Anyone know what I'm talking about? Lol.
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  23. #115
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    Quote Originally Posted by k.nitsua View Post
    I'm game. I was supposed to be in Vegas this summer anyways for the World Series of Poker, but I didn't make enough money before the deadline of the circuit I wanted to get it. Ah well, there's always next year.

    And as far as myself being well versed... my initial major out of high school was Literature and Cultural Arts. I wanted to be a writer... then I realized the jobs behind that major was almost exclusive to jobs that... well... helped people get their Literature and Cultural Arts majors - mainly English teachers.

    So I switched the medical field. Now I'm well versed and can decipher between streptococcus aureus and staphylococcus haemolyticus, lol.

    ... Anyone know what I'm talking about? Lol.
    Dude, if you can beleve it, my 12-year old daughter who's a science wiz just had to explain what that meant to me :P she's obsessed with viruses right now -- here's her words... everone, meet Jordan, beget of TCcentex and her beautiful blonde Momma....

    "Hola. This is Jordan. Currently, I'm working and studying filoviruses. You know, thread viruses. The Marburg/Ebola family, to be more specific. Ebola Zaire, Sudan, Reston and most Recent the Tai strain. It's interesting to me but all of my teachers/friends think it's gross. I think it's cool- quoting Richard Preston, Author of the Hot Zone (book on Marburg and Ebola cases of Zaire, Sudan and Reston)- 'Like staring into the eyes of a cobra, just waiting for it to strike'. :P That's one vacation spot I can mark off my list- Goodbye, Kinshasa/Nairobi Africa "

    ---- TCcentex again, I miss when she would just make coo noises and throw up on me...
    Last edited by TCcentex; 2010-05-21 at 06:14 AM.

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  25. #116
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    Quote Originally Posted by TCcentex View Post
    Dude, if you can beleve it, my 12-year old daughter who's a science wiz just had to explain what that meant to me :P she's obsessed with viruses right now -- here's her words... everone, meet Jordan, beget of TCcentex and her beautiful blonde Momma....

    "Hola. This is Jordan. Currently, I'm working and studying filoviruses. You know, thread viruses. The Marburg/Ebola family, to be more specific. Ebola Zaire, Sudan, Reston and most Recent the Tai strain. It's interesting to me but all of my teachers/friends think it's gross. I think it's cool- quoting Richard Preston, Author of the Hot Zone (book on Marburg and Ebola cases of Zaire, Sudan and Reston)- 'Like staring into the eyes of a cobra, just waiting for it to strike'. :P That's one vacation spot I can mark off my list- Goodbye, Kinshasa/Nairobi Africa "
    ---- TCcentex again, I miss when she would just make coo noises and throw up on me...
    Haha, wow! I like that quote. Most of the strains I deal with are dead, and the live ones are completely harmless. Still very cool to watch.

    Damn, 12 years old? At that age, I spent my free time trying to catch Dragonball Z on the International Channel since the US didn't have new episodes, lol.
    #eli7e revived me

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  27. #117
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    Quote Originally Posted by k.nitsua View Post
    Haha, wow! I like that quote. Most of the strains I deal with are dead, and the live ones are completely harmless. Still very cool to watch.

    Damn, 12 years old? At that age, I spent my free time trying to catch Dragonball Z on the International Channel since the US didn't have new episodes, lol.
    Trust me, she's gaga over the Twilight boys and won't miss an episode of Avatar (when it was still airing -- she watches mostly old stuff now and posts her own stories based on the series on her fan-fiction sites), but yeah, this dumb-*** Banking Executive figured out some way to create a pretty amazing kid. 12 going on 32....

    And by the way santaf - my little girl still won't let me take iKarat off her iTouch and install iFusion on it instaed... "But If I want to see your theme Daddy, I'll just look at your iPhone...."
    she calls you "Haha" because that word is inost of your posts... "daddy, I love Haha's theme! Yours is really nice too".....:/
    Last edited by TCcentex; 2010-05-21 at 06:47 AM. Reason: Automerged Doublepost

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  29. #118
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    HAHA! :P I only say haha on things that make me laugh or chuckle. Well tell her haha appreciates her taking to the theme. And that I didn' tknow what those things were so she has some tallent :P

    and TC it's okay you know she loves your theme too is she on mmi also or something? or does she sit and read posts with you?

  30. #119
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    She occasionally reads the posts with me - especially when I'm laughing my arse off like I had been going through this thread...

  31. #120
    Santa Claus, Theme Creator santaf's Avatar
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    Avatar the last air bender is like one of the best cartoon shows ever created I have the last season and watched every episode within like two days haha.

  32. The Following User Says Thank You to santaf For This Useful Post:

    TCcentex (2010-05-21)

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