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Thread: Vroom - get back ram by managing daemons

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Originally Posted by metaserph Something I found strolling around, for the eggheads: "FlashVM is a promising alternative to existing virtual memory architectures. With flash memory getting cheaper than DRAM and
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  1. #101
    iPhone? More like MyPhone jbone1337's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by metaserph View Post
    Something I found strolling around, for the eggheads: "FlashVM is a promising alternative to existing virtual memory architectures. With flash memory getting cheaper than DRAM and faster than disks, we foresee systems populated with large quantities of flash memory rather than DRAM for satisfying memory intensive workloads. However, the variable and different performance characteristics of flash memory as compared to disks require the re-design of memory management in modern operating systems. In this paper, we list the primary design challenges for FlashVM. Finally, we show that FlashVM has the potential to provide significant performance improvements for real-world applications."

    FlashVM: Revisiting the Virtual Memory Hierarchy

    Could this lead to a solution or are we just "chasing our own tails"? Can the iPhone OS architecture support such and if so, is all that's needed just a modded .plist file?
    EDIT: In addition, seems these VM tweaks follow the principle of Linux / Mac OS of using virtual memory with multiple page files, which is the reccomended method. Just digging to try and bring more clarity, if it's attainable.
    Actually they do have flash memory VM support for vista/win7 in the flash usb drives(it only supports use of 4gb of it). I think its a great idea to get a boost of ram without using the harddrive to do it or upgrading to more ram.

    But you also have to think, its cheaper up front. But take into account that flash memory will wear much faster then a stick of ram would. So how many usb sticks will you have to buy in the time of 1 stick of rams life?

    Not to mention a stick of ram would probably still have lower latencies then using flash memory for VM.

    Quote Originally Posted by PhanaticD View Post
    no it means keep ur vroom scam away




    anyway, the only reason i care about this is because it was like a scam, i dont care if it works or not, i actually might try it later (running low on ram theses days =/), i just dont like how it fooled people into thinking it was a daemon manager
    Well you could check [ame="http://www.ipodtouchfans.com/forums/showthread.php?t=224341"]THIS[/ame] out.(i linked to it earlier in a quote, but not sure if people noticed >.>)

    This is actually managing the daemons. Its not really that hard to do yourself. by deleting ones i didn't need i went from 164-170mb idle to usually 167-172mb idle. Isnt much for the ipod touch 3g. But still didn't need them, so why not lol.

    Even if Vroom or another tweak would do this, i still wouldn't trust IT to tell me what I don't need. i mean some people might need certain ones and others don't. Who's to decide?



    Just thought id post my epicness of 172mb >.o
    and i am fully themed with quite a few apps/tweaks on it. And no VM
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Vroom - get back ram by managing daemons-img_0044.png  
    Last edited by jbone1337; 02-24-2010 at 01:27 PM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by jbone1337 View Post

    Well you could check THIS out.(i linked to it earlier in a quote, but not sure if people noticed >.>)

    This is actually managing the daemons. Its not really that hard to do yourself. by deleting ones i didn't need i went from 164-170mb idle to usually 167-172mb idle. Isnt much for the ipod touch 3g. But still didn't need them, so why not lol.
    yea ive seen this before.. i actually wrote [ame="http://www.ipodwizard.net/showthread.php?t=49289"]this[/ame] tutorial for the site its on =]

    and i have a buttload of stuff on my 2nd gen touch, and it idles around 30mb. if i go on beejive and listen to music it get below ten mb someimtes =/

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    "The Truth" metaserph's Avatar
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    Ok, basic math then: The NAND Flash storage (MLC) has an avg. of 100,000 safe "read/writes", and under normal, average use we may do on top end 100 read/writes a day using VM. So then, 100,000 / 100= 1,000 days of safe read/writes. 1,000 / 365= 2.74 years before "wear" would render the swap file sectors unstable, at which time they are "mapped as bad" and a new sector is used to write to. I visited (easy to Google) tech pages for the drive makers and read reliable (start at Wiki and read it ALL) tech. info. on the drives and their limits.
    For me, I think I can use the VM tweak without killing my phone. Just saying...

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    Quote Originally Posted by metaserph View Post
    Ok, basic math then: The NAND Flash storage (MLC) has an avg. of 100,000 safe "read/writes", and under normal, average use we may do on top end 100 read/writes a day using VM. So then, 100,000 / 100= 1,000 days of safe read/writes. 1,000 / 365= 2.74 years before "wear" would render the swap file sectors unstable, at which time they are "mapped as bad" and a new sector is used to write to. I visited (easy to Google) tech pages for the drive makers and read reliable (start at Wiki and read it ALL) tech. info. on the drives and their limits.
    For me, I think I can use the VM tweak without killing my phone. Just saying...
    Yes thats true. But the VM wont be the same everyday. The amount of writes it uses will vary on how much you use your device and what you are using it for. But even if it averaged to be say 100/day and your device will last 2.74 years.

    Ok ill go with that. But you completely forgot about normal writes. Everytime you add an app/song/movie/notes/contact/call history thats going to be some writes. Everytime you visit a webpage and get cookies those are writes. The caches for safari and other apps are writes. Every time you save a game, thats another write, you see where i am going.

    So dont think you can possibly estimate when the device will die. But i want mine to last a decent amount of time, so id want to stay away from VM. Not to mention when your flash memory starts to fail there is not going to be time to backup stuff ect, it will probably be sudden crash or just loss of data in the sector.
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    The reason I said " for me" is this: I don't have games I play on my iPhone, I have a concise music library which is what I listen to, when I listen to, and otherwise my phone gets regular useage, I'm not "on it" all the time. Another thing I took into consideration is this: Apple is well aware that apps and other system files would do daily read/writes to the flash drive, and some of them do use swap space to operate, and they "deemed these as safe" operations. That, in addition to the aforementioned tech. data from the manufacturers themselves, leads me to believe that, although your points are very valid, it is not as catastrophic as we are lead to believe. Yes, there's definitely a risk involved as "sectors", not the entire drive, can be mapped as unreliable and other sectors would then be used to read/write data to. This is straight from the mfr.'s tech. info. I keep in mind the "swap files" are blocks of 8k, 2 of them that get created and used, though I've had up to 3 of them. Ever so often (every 3 weeks or so) I delete those files and reboot the phone, the sectors get zeroed out and new swap files are created.
    So in my estimation, FOR ME, I'm ok. On the other hand if you constantly use your device for games and other read/write intense operations, your risk is much greater. Having said that, ANY and ALL operations deemed "normal" for an iPhone, listening to music, saving contacts, phone call logs, watching videos, surfing the web, etc, must be deemed safe by Apple to allow such functions without fear of the flash drive crashing, otherwise their liability would be great if they encouraged what they call "normal use" and this in fact was harmful to the device's lifespan. That leads me to believe that, for me, it's not as critical as it will die in 6 months. Just saying..
    Last edited by metaserph; 02-28-2010 at 01:10 PM. Reason: added note.

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