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Thread: AT&T vs Unlimited Plan Users: Round 2

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Originally Posted by JohnGaltJr Meanwhile let's all agree that this has probably NOTHING to do with network congestion- I think that's the one bit I fundamentally disagree with. It is
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    Quote Originally Posted by JohnGaltJr View Post
    Meanwhile let's all agree that this has probably NOTHING to do with network congestion-
    I think that's the one bit I fundamentally disagree with.

    It is not the amount of data but the way it is being used. CDMA stands for Code Division Multiple Access - and while you are tethering you are restricting the multiple access. It has major network consequences which is why it is prohibited.

    Before anyone says AT&T is GSM not CDMA, their 3G network is HSDPA which is Wide-CDMA as opposed to CDMA200 used by Verizon.

    Tethering has a major adverse affect on both voice and data for other people on the same tower.
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    Originally Posted by dannyben
    I'm sure I'll be censored or banned for NOT agreeing with the forum admins / owners, (and I'm not saying I agree or disagree with any of this talk or encouragement to steal) but...

    Can someone please explain why the talk of stealing service and fees to ATT or Verizon, without paying them for their tethering service is permitted (and even encouraged) here, but yet a slight mention of "crack" gets you banned.

    Personally, they are both WRONG & BOTH are theft of services. Why the double standard? The talk of apps like mywi are no different then those of ones like inst**ous. They BOTH are apps that take $$$$ out of the pockets of people who deserve to be compensated.

    Who is having money taken out of their pockets and aren't being compensated? AT&T? You mean the tech that goes into my account and changes a code to allow me to tether? or do you mean Apple who actually built the option into iOS in the first place?

    Why should someone have to pay $20 extra a month for something so simple. I could maybe understand a $5 extra charge but $20/month?

    The phone belongs to me. I own it. The data that goes through my phone is mine, I pay for it. The amount of data I use is mine as well since I have a plan that covers it, unlimited. How I use that data is my business. In that case AT&T might as well tell me I can't watch porn on my iphone. Or block all websites that even mention jailbreaking since they must inevitably lead to AT&T losing money.

    I will do my part and not use fricking god aweful amounts of data each month and slow down the network for everyone else even though I could, but I will be pissed if I am being told how to use a device I own and pay for a service I do not use nearly to the extent I could if I so chose to. This is one of those battles IMO that AT&T does not really want to pick with the majority of it's users. If everyone was to go online and start downloading movies or whatever to max out their already limited wireless network, AT&T would be brought down.

    I would rather have a widerspread wireless network with a slower speed but something that is usable and consistant than have a network that is severly limited but can have some fast speeds in few select locations. I live out in the country, I like the country. I don't want to have to drive to a major city to be able to get 3G coverage. Yet, each month I get charged the same amount as people do in the 3G coverage locations even though I am not afforded the same ability to use what I am paying for. Is that fair? For two years I have paid the same amount as everyone else even though I did not have 3G coverage where I lived. I don't get a portion of that money back. EDGE in my area was so slow that it made dialup feel fast. It wasn't even worth using when I was out of my house and away from WiFi. I used it to only send and receive text email, which was all it was good for.

    How about I get some of my money back from AT&T for that and I will consider paying for my tethering. I have two years worth of data that I am owed IMO that I paid for and AT&T couldn't deliver.

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    Quote Originally Posted by confucious View Post
    I think that's the one bit I fundamentally disagree with.

    It is not the amount of data but the way it is being used. CDMA stands for Code Division Multiple Access - and while you are tethering you are restricting the multiple access. It has major network consequences which is why it is prohibited.

    Before anyone says AT&T is GSM not CDMA, their 3G network is HSDPA which is Wide-CDMA as opposed to CDMA200 used by Verizon.

    Tethering has a major adverse affect on both voice and data for other people on the same tower.
    So tetherers can use all the data they want... if they are willing to line AT&T's pockets more? It just seems so punitive, that's all. If they were really out to improve the network, they would actually improve the network. Just saying...

    You still can't make a frakking call in Manhattan that doesn't get dropped in under 30 seconds. It's NOT rocket science! More towers & repeaters! Bigger backhaul. Etc. After all of these years they should have been able to figure this all out already.

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    Peanut Brain confucious's Avatar
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    The reason people can't make a call in Manhattan is probably because people tether.
    Quite simply, the people who tether are ruining it for everyone else.
    AT&T did not allow tethering at all - that is probably the right way for them to control it as the extra investment needed to cope with tethering is not possible.
    I am sure AT&T would much rather no one tethered at all - their tethering fees are designed to discourage it as a complete ban appears to impossible.
    To argue for tethering and then complain about poor network service is a contradiction.
    The mobile data networks were never designed for that kind of abuse. Just because it can be done does not mena the network can cope with it.
    He who asks a question looks foolish for 5 minutes. He who doesn't ask a question remains foolish forever.

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    Quote Originally Posted by rashad1 View Post
    at&t is simply trying to free up bandwith, and make more money.
    Then build more towers to increase their already spotty coverage.

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    Quote Originally Posted by scottw03 View Post
    Then build more towers to increase their already spotty coverage.
    You have a very simplistic view of how mobile networks actually work. The number of extra towers needed to cope with a few people tethering is out of all proportion.

    Banning tethering completely would increase their coverage far more than doubling or trebling the number of towers.

    People don't seem to understand, or even want to understand what the technical problems are.

    I'm glad I'm not on AT&T - they are in a no win situation.
    He who asks a question looks foolish for 5 minutes. He who doesn't ask a question remains foolish forever.

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    iPhone? More like MyPhone scottw03's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Razz View Post
    Let's get something straight here people. No one has unlimited bandwidth. It's called unmetered. Unlimited refers to speed not consumption.
    How do you figure???

    Hold on, AT&T is doing away with unlimited plans. Ok, so I am still unmetered based on your definition but my bandwidth is now gone from 2MB speed to 1MB speed.

    Amazing how when I check my account each month it says so many MB used out of Unlimited. I don't see anywhere that is says "unmetered".

    Better yet, my nights and weekends are unlimited too. I must have super fast nights and weekends then too. Otherwise it would say unmetered nights and weekends.

    Mobile to Mobile is unlimited too so I get done with my phone call practically as soon as I start since it is so fast.

    From my dataplan description on my account, "Data Plan for iPhone includes unlimited data in the U.S. Access rich HTML email and desktop-level web browsing, as well as Visual Voicemail to listen to voicemail messages in any order you choose".

    I don't see anything in there refering to speed.

    Quote Originally Posted by ggonxhi View Post
    Soon cable companies are going to charge us for having a wireless router at home.

    This is pathetic, if i have unlimited internet it should not matter how much i used.
    Ummmmm, already one step away from there. The TV Networks not wanting to allow people to watch live streaming TV on their iPads for TWC or Cablevision because they aren't getting a piece of the pie. Forget the fact that the cable companies are the ones that are funding the apps to be developed. What are the TV networks paying for and not getting paid for?

    Quote Originally Posted by waddlingduck View Post
    Hi there,


    I haven't been pinged yet by a text or letter. I might use this particular feature at home because the hour I use it each night completely prevents me from having to pay for DSL or Cable internet service (~$40/month) at home. In a year this saves me $480.

    I wouldn't pay for this service if was going to cost me extra per month, in part because it sucks. The speed is ok for general browsing, but that is only when it works. The data service can be as spotty as the voice service.

    What concerns me is this DNS issue. I noticed last night that ADOBE downloaded an entire new version of Acrobat Reader or something, like 70mb+ in the background just because I happened to plug it in. What if Windows Update does the same thing, or my anti-virus, based on an opportunistic noticing of the connection. It'd be a dead giveaway as you mentioned.

    What is a good way to limit data traffic from my computer. I know a firewall prevents INCOMING traffic on unauthorized ports, but I am looking for something kindof of in reverse, and that I can toggle based on whether I am on some other network, or using certain features.

    Any good (and free) ideas? Thanks!
    Turn "Check for updates" or "Automatic Updates" off for these programs and windows. Problem solved for the most part.
    Last edited by scottw03; 04-12-2011 at 03:04 AM. Reason: Automerged Doublepost

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    Quote Originally Posted by csglinux View Post
    Poor grammar, rude & sarcastic - you still want us to believe you don't work for AT&T???

    I wasn't saying nobody is tethering. I was saying that unless you work in AT&T's tethering-detection department, how could you know that most people receiving these messages are tethering?
    Apple estimates only a small percentage of iPhone owners jailbreak. If that's true, I bet most people being targeted are simply heavy data users.

    P.S. you are = you're. "your" is possessive.



    Come on AT&T - how stupid do you think we are? At least make these posts a bit more believable!
    I think your mother is calling you, it is time for you to come upstairs and have supper. Being 30 and living in your mom's basement must be quite fun.

    Was my comment a bit sarcastic, yes it was. Was your reply to my first comment childish, sarcastic and rude, yes it was. Go home and grow up, let the grownups play here.

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    AT&T want's profit to their shareholders. They're not happy if AT&T starts investing heavily on good coverage, and investors get less money.

    In my country every operator has his share of places that they must cover and this is controlled by law. This is why even some remote destinations get good 3G and reasonably fast speeds. Also it's expensive to keep up wired network so they are more and more building wireless instead.

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    Quote Originally Posted by i.Annie View Post
    I'm not sure that making a change to a different type like to GSM is the same as one updating to a 4G device to use 4G. Kind of like the iPhone 2G to 3G when 3G network came out. But with the way AT&T is doing things who knows
    The 3G network was already out when the first generation iPhone came out, not the same as when I had to update from my old a55 Sony Ericsson, (can't remember the model but it had no sim card) to the Nokia 6340i. There was no change in my service plan when I upgraded to the Motorola RAZR. but as I said, 3G was already out....

    I really do believe that when they release 4G we will all lose our "unlimited" plan....

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    iPhone? More like MyPhone scottw03's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by confucious View Post
    You have a very simplistic view of how mobile networks actually work. The number of extra towers needed to cope with a few people tethering is out of all proportion.

    Banning tethering completely would increase their coverage far more than doubling or trebling the number of towers.

    People don't seem to understand, or even want to understand what the technical problems are.

    I'm glad I'm not on AT&T - they are in a no win situation.
    There is really only one reason I went with AT&T when I got back from overseas and that was because of the iPhone. I was with Verizon before I went to the UK for 4 years and I never had a problem with them. I had a basic LG clamshell type phone but it did the job. Made and received calls. It was small and pretty thin.

    For those 4 years in the UK I lived with using a prepaid cell that I barely used for the most part. $20-30 would last me 2-3 months most of the time. With the prices on the phone plans, dataplans and tethering charges, I am probably going to just cut my ties with AT&T when I can, get a 3G or 4G (when Apple makes one) iPad on Verizon and just use Skype to make and receive my calls. I use my mobile devices more for data than voice. I can live with limited voice options. That alone will cut out $59-$79 per phone, per month. Not to mention the network coverage for Verizon being a hell of a lot bigger (maybe slower but still fast enough to handle VoIP calls). I talk to my wife over Skype now on my iphone 4 using slow *** wifi and for the most part the voice comes through just like a regular call, sometimes better. I can live with that.

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    Quote Originally Posted by scottw03 View Post
    There is really only one reason I went with AT&T when I got back from overseas and that was because of the iPhone. I was with Verizon before I went to the UK for 4 years and I never had a problem with them. I had a basic LG clamshell type phone but it did the job. Made and received calls. It was small and pretty thin.

    For those 4 years in the UK I lived with using a prepaid cell that I barely used for the most part. $20-30 would last me 2-3 months most of the time. With the prices on the phone plans, dataplans and tethering charges, I am probably going to just cut my ties with AT&T when I can, get a 3G or 4G (when Apple makes one) iPad on Verizon and just use Skype to make and receive my calls. I use my mobile devices more for data than voice. I can live with limited voice options. That alone will cut out $59-$79 per phone, per month. Not to mention the network coverage for Verizon being a hell of a lot bigger (maybe slower but still fast enough to handle VoIP calls). I talk to my wife over Skype now on my iphone 4 using slow *** wifi and for the most part the voice comes through just like a regular call, sometimes better. I can live with that.
    While that seems like a good plan, I would imagine that the days of unlimited data for one price will soon be over for all carriers, as well as all devices. Verizon and at&t will do away with it soon enough, as we have seen from this thread, there are just way too many ways for people to use very large amounts of data. It sounds like that is already the model used in parts of Europe, and I imagine it will soon be the same here. Maybe something will change and make the whole point moot, but until that happens I think we are kind of stuck.

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    Quote Originally Posted by javiert30 View Post
    In our contract with ATT, under iPhone and Certain Other Devices says:

    I agree that ATT may add required plans to my account and bill me the appropriate monthly fee if I use an iPhone or other device that has plan requirements.

    So if they do it, we all going to have to pay the early termination fee agreement $325.00 to cancel the contract. But I tell you what, I will pay it without think about it.
    Here is what I found...

    >AT&T Wireless Customer Agreement > 1.0 TERM COMMITMENT, CHARGES BILLING AND PAYMENT > 1.3 Can AT&T Change My Terms And Rates?

    "IF WE INCREASE THE PRICE OF ANY OF THE SERVICES TO WHICH YOU SUPSCRIBE, BEYOND THE LIMITS SET FORTH IN YOUR CUSTOMER SERVICE SUMMARY, OR IF WE MATERIALLY DECREASE THE GEOGRAPHICAL AREA IN WHICH YOUR AIRTIME RATE APPLIES (OTHER THAN A TEMPORARY DECREASE FOR REPAIRS OR MAINTENANCE), WE WILL DISCLOSE THE CHANGE AT LEAST 1 BILLING CYCLE IN ADVANCE (EITHER THROUGH A NOTICE WITH YOUR BILL, A TEXT MESSAGE TO YOUR DEVICE, OR OTHERWISE), AND YOU MAY TERMINATE THIS AGREEMENT WITHOUT PAYING AN EARLY TERMINATION FEE OR RETURNING OR PAYING FOR ANY PROMOTIONAL ITEMS, PROVIDED YOUR NOTICE OF TERMINATION IS DELIVERED TO US WITHIN 30 DAYS AFTER THE FIRST BILL REFLECTING THE CHANGE"

    Seems to me that if they change my contract and can not "Prove"I was tethering I can cancel my contact and move to another carrier with out paying an un-Godly $285.00 early termination fee... What do you think???

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    Quote Originally Posted by confucious View Post
    I think that's the one bit I fundamentally disagree with.

    It is not the amount of data but the way it is being used. CDMA stands for Code Division Multiple Access - and while you are tethering you are restricting the multiple access. It has major network consequences which is why it is prohibited.

    Before anyone says AT&T is GSM not CDMA, their 3G network is HSDPA which is Wide-CDMA as opposed to CDMA200 used by Verizon.

    Tethering has a major adverse affect on both voice and data for other people on the same tower.
    So your and other PRO AT&T (suspected employees) solution is to what? Go backward 20 years and eliminate or restrict data so we are the least advanced country, wow!

    I do not see it is the customers problem, we pay more for sevice in this country and you want us to have less to "help" At&t because the money they spend on modern equipment reduces the enormous profits they make. Further more 1/3 of the USA will soon be under the (missmanagement) management of At&t.

    You really want to blame the customer for poor service a company provides? Because we pay for the service they are unwilling to aupport? Wow

    I want to say so much but it would violate TOS

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    Peanut Brain confucious's Avatar
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    You suspect me of working for AT&T? What an interesting concept.

    Your contract prohibits tethering - why do you think you are entitled to it? Unless you pay for tethering - in which case you get support. I'm not sure what your question is?
    He who asks a question looks foolish for 5 minutes. He who doesn't ask a question remains foolish forever.

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    Quote Originally Posted by confucious View Post
    You suspect me of working for AT&T? What an interesting concept.

    Your contract prohibits tethering - why do you think you are entitled to it? Unless you pay for tethering - in which case you get support. I'm not sure what your question is?
    Why not? Everyone works for someone. Either paid or not.

    I answered the failed concept of "congestion" as the customer's fault.

    As for questions? Why? Why must I post a question?

    You have read my contact? Wow!

    You suppose a lot.

    As far as contract At&t does not provide what they contract people for, if they do not follow the contract how do they expect the customers to? Maybe because its unresonable for both sides?

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    >AT&T Wireless Customer Agreement > 1.0 TERM COMMITMENT, CHARGES BILLING AND PAYMENT > 1.3 Can AT&T Change My Terms And Rates?

    "IF WE INCREASE THE PRICE OF ANY OF THE SERVICES TO WHICH YOU SUPSCRIBE, BEYOND THE LIMITS SET FORTH IN YOUR CUSTOMER SERVICE SUMMARY, OR IF WE MATERIALLY DECREASE THE GEOGRAPHICAL AREA IN WHICH YOUR AIRTIME RATE APPLIES (OTHER THAN A TEMPORARY DECREASE FOR REPAIRS OR MAINTENANCE), WE WILL DISCLOSE THE CHANGE AT LEAST 1 BILLING CYCLE IN ADVANCE (EITHER THROUGH A NOTICE WITH YOUR BILL, A TEXT MESSAGE TO YOUR DEVICE, OR OTHERWISE), AND YOU MAY TERMINATE THIS AGREEMENT WITHOUT PAYING AN EARLY TERMINATION FEE OR RETURNING OR PAYING FOR ANY PROMOTIONAL ITEMS, PROVIDED YOUR NOTICE OF TERMINATION IS DELIVERED TO US WITHIN 30 DAYS AFTER THE FIRST BILL REFLECTING THE CHANGE"

    Seems to me that if they change my contract and can not "Prove"I was tethering I can cancel my contact and move to another carrier with out paying an un-Godly $285.00 early termination fee... What do you think???

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    Quote Originally Posted by alexevo View Post
    I enjoy my unlimited data but I don't really use it to its fullest. My current data usage is just over 200MB a month from my last billing cycle. The only reason I'm actually keeping my unlimited data is so when I eventually want to sell my SIM card to someone it will be worth a lot more since it has the unlimited data grandfathered in but honestly I don't use that much data since it kills my battery.

    So...anyone want unlimited data? Offer up!
    Are you kidding me?!? I HOPE you don't think unlimited data is in ANY way tied to your SIM card... Unless you intend on surrendering your entire account, phone, and phone number to the highest bidder, you're an idiot.

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    Quote Originally Posted by MYPHONEI View Post
    Why not? Everyone works for someone. Either paid or not.

    I answered the failed concept of "congestion" as the customer's fault.

    As for questions? Why? Why must I post a question?

    You have read my contact? Wow!

    You suppose a lot.

    As far as contract At&t does not provide what they contract people for, if they do not follow the contract how do they expect the customers to? Maybe because its unresonable for both sides?
    Perhaps you just might want to do a little bit of research before you start calling people out for working at at&t. Confucious is a very respected member of this community, unlike yourself, who is connected with the jailbreakers themselves.

    Additionally, not all other countries allow unlimited data usage, at least according to numerous posts here.

    Seems to me much more likely you work for one of At&t's competitors.

    Quote Originally Posted by Yrjan View Post
    >AT&T Wireless Customer Agreement > 1.0 TERM COMMITMENT, CHARGES BILLING AND PAYMENT > 1.3 Can AT&T Change My Terms And Rates?

    "IF WE INCREASE THE PRICE OF ANY OF THE SERVICES TO WHICH YOU SUPSCRIBE, BEYOND THE LIMITS SET FORTH IN YOUR CUSTOMER SERVICE SUMMARY, OR IF WE MATERIALLY DECREASE THE GEOGRAPHICAL AREA IN WHICH YOUR AIRTIME RATE APPLIES (OTHER THAN A TEMPORARY DECREASE FOR REPAIRS OR MAINTENANCE), WE WILL DISCLOSE THE CHANGE AT LEAST 1 BILLING CYCLE IN ADVANCE (EITHER THROUGH A NOTICE WITH YOUR BILL, A TEXT MESSAGE TO YOUR DEVICE, OR OTHERWISE), AND YOU MAY TERMINATE THIS AGREEMENT WITHOUT PAYING AN EARLY TERMINATION FEE OR RETURNING OR PAYING FOR ANY PROMOTIONAL ITEMS, PROVIDED YOUR NOTICE OF TERMINATION IS DELIVERED TO US WITHIN 30 DAYS AFTER THE FIRST BILL REFLECTING THE CHANGE"

    Seems to me that if they change my contract and can not "Prove"I was tethering I can cancel my contact and move to another carrier with out paying an un-Godly $285.00 early termination fee... What do you think???
    You can always try. If they can prove you are tethering you will be responsible for the ETf. What I would worry about is that they can't tell, but they go ahead and change everyone regardless, and then let you all worry about it for the next few years. That is why, at a minimum, if you get the notice I would call them and deny and hope, or stop doing it.
    Last edited by Moosestache; 04-12-2011 at 09:20 AM. Reason: Automerged Doublepost

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    Quote Originally Posted by Moosestache View Post
    Perhaps you just might want to do a little bit of research before you start calling people out for working at at&t. Confucious is a very respected member of this community, unlike yourself, who is connected with the jailbreakers themselves.

    Additionally, not all other countries allow unlimited data usage, at least according to numerous posts here.

    Seems to me much more likely you work for one of At&t's competitors.
    Lol good try. Just because somone has been posting for years you claim we know who they are and agendas.

    All I can say within TOS is WOW!

    It amazes me the effort you put into defending At&t, it does put suspicion to the readers as to what agenda is behind the effort.

    ModmyI has over 700,000 members and perhaps million's of readers so why would it be so far a reach as to a multi billion dollar company having a few fanboys posting for them?

    Yes "poor At&t"

    If you have no agenda with At&t then prove it by posts and actions.

    So far its clear which side some are on.

    I'm not anti At&t but I disagree with what they do at times.

    I have nothing to say about other countries, should we not embrace new technology and not go backwards? Limiting the web and our data use ability does nothing but hold us back.

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