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I have a real job - and tuesdays are my busiest day the other week. You'll need to remake the popcorn later. Originally Posted by Simon You never provided any
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  1. #121
    The Big D NewdestinyX's Avatar
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    I have a real job - and tuesdays are my busiest day the other week. You'll need to remake the popcorn later.

    Quote Originally Posted by Simon View Post
    You never provided any proof man. Show me where you did and I will proclaim myself blind.

    And you really don't want to use ellersbee as a example of anything. I'm not gonna outright bash him because I was always friendly with him and thought he was a good guy, some of the things he did here though are just downright mind boggling.
    I provided the 'exact same' level of proof as you did, Simon: 1)my own personal tests 2) the input of a known developer.. EXACT same level of proof, bro. I repeat - you are being blind.

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    Quote Originally Posted by NewdestinyX View Post
    I have a real job - and tuesdays are my busiest day the other week. You'll need to remake the popcorn later.

    I provided the 'exact same' level of proof as you did, Simon: 1)my own personal tests 2) the input of a known developer.. EXACT same level of proof, bro. I repeat - you are being blind.
    Don't do this to me man. I didn't get all dressed up for no reason.

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  4. #123
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    Quote Originally Posted by krima View Post
    don't do this to me man. I didn't get all dressed up for no reason.
    lol..

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    Superbad Modder-ator Simon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by NewdestinyX View Post
    I have a real job - and tuesdays are my busiest day the other week. You'll need to remake the popcorn later.

    I provided the 'exact same' level of proof as you did, Simon: 1)my own personal tests 2) the input of a known developer.. EXACT same level of proof, bro. I repeat - you are being blind.
    You didn't provide proof. You provided your experience from past updates and then just said the developer said those things. I tried it right there and then yesterday and went out and actually talked to one of the devs. Which developer were you saying said these things? Musclenerd? Where and when did he say it? Proof is providing that, not just saying you saw him say it one time but don't know where or when.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Simon View Post
    You didn't provide proof. You provided your experience from past updates and then just said the developer said those things. I tried it right there and then yesterday and went out and actually talked to one of the devs. Which developer were you saying said these things? Musclenerd? Where and when did he say it? Proof is providing that, not just saying you saw him say it one time but don't know where or when.
    Still blind, Simon. You did NOT provide a link to your communication with h8. You expected us to take YOUR word for it - SIMPLY because you're Simon. The 'timing' of my tests - current or past is entirely irrelevant, dude. And you just don't see it. That's being 'blind'. I'm sorry, man - I don't know what more I can explain to make you get it - that "MY" level of proof was 'exactly the same' as yours.

    You win your points in this debate when you refer to 'my delivery'. I've accept a lot of egg on my face through the last year - learning more about that. But in this debate - King was wrong. MJ was wrong - even YOU have been believing the myth of accidental restore via OTA. Nobody wanted to admit it. The fact that "I" knew something, as fact, that the major players here did not - irks some of you. So in the absence of a good argument you attack. Generally you don't, Simon. You're levelheaded and fair. But on this issue you've been blind. You're trying to say that my level of proof was different than yours. It was not. It just wasn't, bro.

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    Quote Originally Posted by NewdestinyX View Post
    I have a real job
    Ahhh, so my job isn't real?

    Hold on, let me go into my basement and startup my money printing machine.

    Maybe you should have studied harder in school and you could have gotten real pay with that real job!

    Don't freak out, those were just jokes
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  9. #127
    Superbad Modder-ator Simon's Avatar
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    Fair enough. Here you go.

    My proof: https://twitter.com/x98car/status/306180592326823936
    And I even did some work to find your proof: https://twitter.com/MuscleNerd/status/94553431452286976
    and here: iOS 5 Beta 4 Blocks Jailbreakers From OTA Updates

    I believe what King, Mamajaay and Ken were seeing is malfunctions in this /applications check OTA does when looking for a jailbreak.

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    Quote Originally Posted by NewdestinyX View Post
    - King was wrong
    So you are saying that I lied about what happened to me.

    Ok, I made the whole thing up just to argue with you.

    It hath been decreed that:

    Software is absolute, there is no way that 2 people can have different experiences!

    If you see it posted on twitter, it must be 100% true! (Because you can't post anything that isn't true on the Internet! That's from statefarm commercial)

    If it doesn't happen to NewD, it can't happen to anyone!


    These are the laws that have been set forth this 26th day of February, 2013!
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    Quote Originally Posted by Simon View Post
    Fair enough. Here you go.

    My proof: https://twitter.com/x98car/status/306180592326823936
    And I even did some work to find your proof: https://twitter.com/MuscleNerd/status/94553431452286976
    and here: iOS 5 Beta 4 Blocks Jailbreakers From OTA Updates

    I believe what King, Mamajaay and Ken were seeing is malfunctions in this /applications check OTA does when looking for a jailbreak.
    Now THERE you go! That's the fairminded respect-worthy Simon I've come to appreciate here! Thank you so much for wrapping it all up. I wish this post was back in the the more 'public' iWidgets thread so the 'public' would see it. And it's very good to know what could explain MamaJaay's and King's and Ken's experiences too. The chance of the /applications thing happening seems pretty rare to me. But if there's even the smallest potential for loss of jailbreak - I continue to harken back to MJ's statement "double protection". Would you say - that this is why the evasi0n team found it important to block the OTA possibility? That would make sense to me.

    Again, thanks, Simon.

    Still waiting for you to admit, King, that you didn't know about OTA blocking post iOS5.

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    Superbad Modder-ator Simon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by NewdestinyX View Post
    Now THERE you go! That's the fairminded respect-worthy Simon I've come to appreciate here! Thank you so much for wrapping it all up. I wish this post was back in the the more 'public' iWidgets thread so the 'public' would see it. And it's very good to know what could explain MamaJaay's and King's and Ken's experiences too. The chance of the /applications thing happening seems pretty rare to me. But if there's even the smallest potential for loss of jailbreak - I continue to harken back to MJ's statement "double protection". Would you say - that this is why the evasi0n team found it important to block the OTA possibility? That would make sense to me.

    Again, thanks, Simon.

    Still waiting for you to admit, King, that you didn't know about OTA blocking post iOS5.
    Ya, there seems to be a small chance this OTA jailbreak check can fail and end up either causing recovery or actually updating the device. Not to mention the nuisance of seeing that popup about an update and the little red number on settings it does. All those reasons are probably why the evaders added it to evasi0n, and why tweaks like noupdate exist in cydia.

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    Quote Originally Posted by NewdestinyX View Post
    Still waiting for you to admit, King, that you didn't know about OTA blocking post iOS5.
    I'm confused here. You want me to admit that I didn't know the feature existed? Where did I say that it didn't exist? I said that it was possible.

    I thought the issue was that it was not possible to update a JB device with OTA? My only comment was that it is possible, as I did it!

    My issue is that your point seems to be that if Apple put it in there it must prevent updates 100% of the time. If Apple was that good, then how is jailbreaking possible?
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    Quote Originally Posted by King_O_Hill View Post
    I'm confused here. You want me to admit that I didn't know the feature existed? Where did I say that it didn't exist? I said that it was possible.

    I thought the issue was that it was not possible to update a JB device with OTA? My only comment was that it is possible, as I did it!

    My issue is that your point seems to be that if Apple put it in there it must prevent updates 100% of the time. If Apple was that good, then how is jailbreaking possible?
    King - you seem to be backpedalling. For once, since I've known you, bro, admit - you did NOT know something that I did know. We agree (and evidence shows) that something has to 'go terribly wrong' for the phone to be forced to update - and even then - usually you're caught in a bootloop like MJ was and THAT's the reason for loss of jailbreak and NOT the OTA upgrade process itself. (I know that point's moot in a way since you still lose your jailbreak).

    And your instance was 5.1.1. I've never said it didn't happen. I said it's not worth all the fear promulgated around here about OTA - since it's so rare. And in 6 it is "virtually" impossible. You did NOT know that, my friend, now did you. Please admit when Simon came back with his results and input from h8 that you were surprised. I know you were - but You'll never admit it.. .. Because you're the 'King of the Hill'. If you want to elevate yourself to MescleNerd and h8's level (and maybe you are) and tell them they're full of soup - go for it. But it would look 'prideful'. I travelled from forum to forum to blog, etc.. and found that this was really the only place still warning people about the accidental OTA update. So I shared my supported findings after a lot of research, and RIGHT ON CUE, I get bashed.

    No hard feelings man.. I'm just saying.. that admitting a lapse in knowledge can be freeing! I should know. LOL! I was simply right on this one and you didn't, shall we say, "have the same information at hand". And you called me out on it and condescendingly told me to 'go back to my corner' and that I was out of my league. And yet I was right this time. That dig to me was uncalled for and you know it, bro. I am no coder. But I don't NEED to be - to know how iOS works and to do solid research before I speak up. The 'elitism' here sometimes is astonishing. But still - way more good here than bad. And you spend a LOT of time helping here. That's huge.. Just come down a peg or two, bro. .... Pretty please?
    Last edited by NewdestinyX; 02-26-2013 at 11:29 AM.

  17. #133
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  19. #134
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    Quote Originally Posted by kenboyles72 View Post
    ..
    Ken my man, nice quote!
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    Quote Originally Posted by kenboyles72
    It is better for a man the be silent and thought a fool,
    than to open his mouth and remove all doubt.
    When people can't refute with facts or have run out of ideas - their last resort is personal insults. Sadly it's the mark of a weak mind.

    And a person who can't admit they're ever wrong can be perceived as fatuous and pompous. In each case someone has shown me I've erred - I've accepted it and made ammends if needed. Others prefer to present themselves at elite. It is what it is.

    Now - to deal with these two issue from this morning. Though we've near talked this subject to death now.
    Quote Originally Posted by Krima View Post
    @NewDestiny I think what u should take away from this is that people respond the way they do with u because of your tone and delivery of this"helpful" information. When someone has established themselves as being level headed and reasonable u generally take what he says with greater weight than say someone that is argumentative and contentious. Simon has established himself as the former and unfortunately u the latter. When u brought up the whole mmi not the be all end all and trying to give legitimacy to your claim by stating how smart u are, this can be off putting to some.
    First of all, Krima - just who the 'he**' do you think you are sometimes?!! As if you have enough life experience to 'preach to me'. Your cutting sarcasm all day long is childish and offputting too. You think it doesn't affect people. And second of all you play your deception game again with your last statement there. You know DAMNED well I didn't mention my education to put myself on a pedestal - but only to offer credence tha,t as King's coding experience gives him CLOUT and GRAVITAS in matters of making a widget work, my GPA gives me clout that I KNOW how to study/research well. Noting more. Not that I'm smarter. But simply that I've mastered the ability to study well. That's the only reason I placed it there; as merely an example of a reason why I 'just may be' considered 'well-studied' on the matters I speak into around here. You think SO shallowly sometimes and prove pretty quickly that you may enjoy "trolling me" (the true definition of troll) than actually offering 'constructive feedback.

    My thought is only this, if u r smart u do not have to take so many opportunities to point this out.
    Again - an exaggeration. To this day I've said NOTHING of my education. Not a word.
    King is obviously a smart guy with all this coding business and Pinoy with his modding skills but I rarely, if ever, hear them say how smart they are and try to force people to respect them.
    I beg to differ. King requires us to 'bow to him' all the time. If you're not in 'his league' you better shut up. He has a constant chip on his shoulder and is angry at anybody and anything. I learn a lot from King - but he sure does behave badly a lot. It's as if he can't yell at his boss or family so comes here to the forum to be 'the King'. It's SO offputting and you just give him a pass. If "I" acted and said the things he did - you would all crucify me.
    If u want to help just help without trying to establish yourself as one of the most knowledgeable people on here. Humility will go a long way here I think and resolve 99.91538% of your issues here. See what I did there, lol.
    Distortion after distortion. Again - stop preaching. It doesn't become you, bro. And I don't need to learn anything from you. I've been on the planet a long time and know when I see people jockeying for position and uncomfortable when another 'alpha male' steps into the room.

    Quote Originally Posted by King_O_Hill View Post
    @NewD
    1st, you can't tell me that my experience doesn't count.
    Never once challenged your experience, bro. But like you accuse me of - you held your 'single' experience up as if it was the single piece of defining evidence that Accidental OTA is NOT a myth - when it is.

    2nd, you are making the mistake that you always make in that we are talking about hacked software here. Even without it being hacked, you cannot make absolute statements about what an OS can and can't do. It is written by humans that obviously make mistakes, or jail breaking would not exist. For anyone to make a statement that implies that something is 100% impossible, just shows their ignorance to fully understand software. I don't care how good anybody thinks they are, there are always exceptions to the rules. There will always be someone that has a different experience due to any number of reasons. You seem to want to put everything into a black or white category, when there is way more gray area.
    Most things are black and white in the world of 1's and 0's, King. You of all people should know that. But you gain points on this argument and I will cede that point to you that in a hacked software environment there can be 'special situations' as I've acknowledged you experienced with OTA that can happen. You and I also push our phones to greater limits than others I'll guess. So more can happen.

    What did you want from me to admit, I stated what my experience was and you told me that it wasn't possible. What comment could I possibly make at that point. I'm not admitting that I was "dead wrong" in my experience, because you got a an opinion from someone on twitter or something like that. I do my own research and don't rely on what others tell me and then take it as gospel.
    This is that fatuous elitism thing again, King. You do NOT know more than the devs. You may know 'as much'. But not more. And if a vast majority of us have tried OTA after jailbreak and it doesn't work - that DOES prove one thing - to any intelligent person. It proves your case was 'unique' and not common. And you have no evidence to back up your claim with iOS6. NO one - has been able to report a successful OTA update from being jailbroken on iOS6. Go ahead and try - right now. You'll see it's just not possible. But you won't do the test. It's okay. I've gotten used to letting you have the last word and be King - by pushing others down who think differently.

    The main and only thing I wanted you to admit - to get 'equilibirum' back in our working relationship here on the forum - was to admit, NOT so much that you were wrong about the 'mythical nature' of accidental OTA when jailbroken - but was to 'admit' that maybe your comment that "I'm out of my league" to even present the case that accidental OTA was an infinitessimally rare thing. And then evidence after evidence came in supporting my input to the forum. At that point I expected, even a snide comment like -- "well maybe our young patawan is ONTO something here". Even THAT would have showed 'collegiality'. King. You're pretty easy to get along with in PM. I wish THAT guy would show up on open forum more often. And the guy who wants to win the 'pis*ing' contest should stay at home.

    Peace
    Last edited by NewdestinyX; 02-26-2013 at 06:43 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by kenboyles72 View Post
    You cannot reason with a hungry belly; it has no ears.
    O gosh. What nonsense.

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    Quote Originally Posted by kenboyles72 View Post
    every jacka$$ loves to hear himself bray.
    * plonk *

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