• Your favorite

    Apple

    ,

    iPhone

    ,

    iPad

    ,

    iOS

    ,
    Jailbreak
    , and
    Cydia
    site.
  • Jobs Responds to Angry Customer about No FireWire Port


    An angry customer, and previously loyal MacBook fan, emailed Steve Jobs about the new 13 inch MacBooks not having a FireWire port and received a response.

    Characteristic of Jobs, he only briefly responded with one line;

    "Actually, all of the new HD camcorders of the past few years use USB 2."

    AppleInsider experts have validated the authenticity of Jobs response with a great degree of certainty.

    Jobs and FireWire ports have a long history together; after all it was Apple that invented the FireWire port in the late 80s as a replacement for SCSI. Apple released the technology through a standards body to become IEEE 1394, while DEC, Texas Instruments, and Sony contributed to the development of FireWire ports.

    As FireWire was really taking off as the new technology for video and music applications, Jobs tried to procure some licensing royalties from it for Apple after his return to the company in 1997. However, it was ironically the 1998 iMac that really began to push the adoption of USB and in 2005 Apple took FireWire Synce out of the iPod. Another instance of Apple always pushing the envelope on the latest and greatest technological advances.

    In his response, Jobs was correct, as Canon, Hitachi, JVC, Samsung and Sony all use USB 2.0 to transfer footage.

    David responded

    Hi Steve,

    Thanks for the fast response! In answer to your statement, though, I decided to look at the selection of camcorders on BestBuy.com since I believe they represent a pretty average staple of what consumer electronics people are buying. Although you are correct that (almost) all of the new HD camcorders use USB 2.0, there are still many, many standard definition camcorders (read: affordable for average Joes) that require firewire. Does this mean to say that Apple no longer supports average Joes from making home movies on their computers? In other words, if I have a $300 firewire camcorder and a new MacBook, shouldn’t I be able to edit videos of my kid's birthday just as easily as someone who has a MacBook Pro and a $1200 HD camcorder?

    Sincerely,

    -David


    Interestingly, perhaps in an effort to smooth things over, Jobs sent this angry customer (David) another confirmed email from his iPhone,

    The new HD camcorders start around $500.

    What do you guys think about FireWire port missing? My husband has a MacBook Pro and a USB 2.0 camcorder, so I don’t miss it…but I have a few friends who do…

    Source:

    AppleInsider | Jobs responds to outrage over MacBook's missing FireWire [u]
    This article was originally published in forum thread: Jobs Responds to Angry Customer about No FireWire Port started by AppleChic View original post
    Comments 50 Comments
    1. haibane's Avatar
      haibane -
      Firewire 800 is faster than usb 2.0 so if they did away with firewire 800 they are stupid.
    1. sziklassy's Avatar
      sziklassy -
      This guy argues that the "average joe" can't afford camcorder over 300 bucks, but they are willing to toss down $1300-1600 for the new MacBook. I think the argument he puts up is weak, at best. Show Apple you disapprove by not buying their stuff, not a letter of complaint!

      Also... you can buy a firewire to USB cable for under 10 bucks, something that I think even the Average Joe can afford, especially if he is willing to throw down 1.5 grand for a new laptop...

      Yeah firewire is faster... don't ask me why the industry has (mostly) gone with USB over firewire, but the fact of the matter is, they have. It has gotten to the point where you actually have to LOOK for something that will plug into your firewire port. I think this is what Apple is noticing as well and is looking to the future.
    1. D to the M's Avatar
      D to the M -
      I never in my life have ever used firewire. Always USB. So I would actually perfer to take that firewire port off my macbook and get another USB.
    1. organik's Avatar
      organik -
      Actually, there is no such thing as usb2 to firewire cable, or adapter. They are not compatible, in any way.

      There is usb2 to usb1.1 and firewire 800 to firewire 400, but those are part of each respective standard.

      To repeat, because this misinformation is flying around everywhere...it is impossible to use firewire devices with a usb2 connection!
    1. fungrified's Avatar
      fungrified -
      i only ever used firewire for my old iPods and movie camera.. now all i have is two dusty little holes in the back of my imac that never get used.

      i was surprised that apple removed firewire support for ipods, why did they do that?
    1. mtwiford's Avatar
      mtwiford -
      Quote Originally Posted by sziklassy View Post
      This guy argues that the "average joe" can't afford camcorder over 300 bucks, but they are willing to toss down $1300-1600 for the new MacBook. I think the argument he puts up is weak, at best. Show Apple you disapprove by not buying their stuff, not a letter of complaint!

      Also... you can buy a firewire to USB cable for under 10 bucks, something that I think even the Average Joe can afford, especially if he is willing to throw down 1.5 grand for a new laptop...

      Yeah firewire is faster... don't ask me why the industry has (mostly) gone with USB over firewire, but the fact of the matter is, they have. It has gotten to the point where you actually have to LOOK for something that will plug into your firewire port. I think this is what Apple is noticing as well and is looking to the future.

      I totally agree with you. The average joe does not own a mac and if you own a mac and are doing standard definition recording, you wasted your money anyways. It is apples way of distinguishing the macbook from the macbook pro. If you want firewire, then buy a macbook pro.
    1. bobby_nguyen's Avatar
      bobby_nguyen -
      parallel port ... ftw
    1. mtwiford's Avatar
      mtwiford -
      Quote Originally Posted by bobby_nguyen View Post
      parallel port ... Ftw
      lmao
    1. davidmdowning42's Avatar
      davidmdowning42 -
      I understand looking to the future and this move doesn't surprise me.

      BUT it seems to me that a major selling point of Apple is that makes really high quality hardware that is built to last. Steve always says that Apple won't ship junk. And that is supposed to be why their hardware is so expensive. Like say, my wife's G2 iPod. It still works great and needs a firewire port. I know that Apple, like any company, would rather me buy a new iPod than hang on to the old one for more than 5 years. But then why make it so well? Why insist on the highest quality parts that drive up the price of all of their machines, only to short-cut their durability by purposefully doing things like this? It undermines the whole rationale behind making such expensive machines. If they aren't going to keep supporting older products that still work because they are so well made, then they might as well stop making them so well and make them cheaper.
    1. phillipxenxciel's Avatar
      phillipxenxciel -
      well, since the firewire become not so popular~~i think this is not a bad move~~
    1. unlockme's Avatar
      unlockme -
      i use firewire for my external hard drive. i'm a firewire noob but i can say its much faster than usb. no mac, just pc.
    1. gothi's Avatar
      gothi -
      Your news post is incorrect in this paragraph:
      Interestingly, perhaps in an effort to smooth things over, Jobs sent this angry customer (David) another confirmed email from his iPhone,

      “The new HD camcorders start around $500.”

      To which David responded


      Hi Steve,

      Thanks for the fast response! In answer to your statement, though, I decided to look at the selection of camcorders on BestBuy.com since I believe they represent a pretty average staple of what consumer electronics people are buying. Although you are correct that (almost) all of the new HD camcorders use USB 2.0, there are still many, many standard definition camcorders (read: affordable for average Joes) that require firewire. Does this mean to say that Apple no longer supports average Joes from making home movies on their computers? In other words, if I have a $300 firewire camcorder and a new MacBook, shouldn’t I be able to edit videos of my kid's birthday just as easily as someone who has a MacBook Pro and a $1200 HD camcorder?

      Sincerely,

      -David”
      admin edit: oops. corrected. thanks


      Steve sent that response to David's email which is listed below it, not the other way round. Jobs sent the last communication, you present it as if David does after Jobs sends a second email about camera prices.

      So it should be:

      David sent another email to Steve stating that whilst Steve was correct in his statement about USB2 being the standard, camcorders using this cost $1200.
      Steve quickly responded from his iPhone, informing David that the camcorders in question actually start at $500, only $200 more than David claims to have paid for a standard definition camcorder.
    1. Turanli's Avatar
      Turanli -
      Cool... now we have Steve Jobs email ?
    1. sziklassy's Avatar
      sziklassy -
      Quote Originally Posted by davidmdowning42 View Post
      I understand looking to the future and this move doesn't surprise me.

      BUT it seems to me that a major selling point of Apple is that makes really high quality hardware that is built to last. Steve always says that Apple won't ship junk. And that is supposed to be why their hardware is so expensive. Like say, my wife's G2 iPod. It still works great and needs a firewire port. I know that Apple, like any company, would rather me buy a new iPod than hang on to the old one for more than 5 years. But then why make it so well? Why insist on the highest quality parts that drive up the price of all of their machines, only to short-cut their durability by purposefully doing things like this? It undermines the whole rationale behind making such expensive machines. If they aren't going to keep supporting older products that still work because they are so well made, then they might as well stop making them so well and make them cheaper.
      I don't necessarily disagree but we can also make the argument, then, that we need parallel printer ports, zip drives, floppy disc drives, etc. Also, competitors like dell don;t use "cheap" stuff in the way you are implaying (I interpret your statement of cheap as it will break over use). Apple simply takes the fastest CPUs, fastest RAM, etc. which drives prices up. Simply put Apple only makes models of computers (and other products) that literally ARE the top end of other companies (let's use Dell again, why not) and don't make a lower end product. We just tend to call, say the Macbook base model, the lower end, when really it is not at all a "base" system.
    1. dennder's Avatar
      dennder -
      I have a M-AUDIO FireWire 410 (semi-pro external audio i/o device).
      It is designed to be "do music on the go". Newer, better one - FireWire 610 has been introduced few weeks ago. Both still use FW !ONLY!

      I have all the macs around and i've planned to buy a new macbook...
      So what now? MBP or competition?

      Despite the fact, that i became an apple fan - **** happens, apple! =(

      sziklassy
      Apple simply takes the fastest CPUs, fastest RAM, etc.
      I disagree. It does not. The fastest ones are always optional and for additional charge higher, than in competiting products. GPU's arent the fastest at all.

      I agree though, that apple low-end is mostly "high-ender" than the competiting mid level products.
    1. sziklassy's Avatar
      sziklassy -
      Quote Originally Posted by dennder View Post
      I have a M-AUDIO FireWire 410 (semi-pro external audio i/o device).
      It is designed to be "do music on the go". Newer, better one - FireWire 610 has been introduced few weeks ago. Both still use FW !ONLY!

      I have all the macs around and i've planned to buy a new macbook...
      So what now? MBP or competition?

      Despite the fact, that i became an apple fan - **** happens, apple! =(
      If you really want the MB there are USB to firewire cables on eBay (and I assume elsewhere for that matter) for 10 bucks or less.
    1. MJedi's Avatar
      MJedi -
      Okay, so how are the new MacBooks supposed to do FireWire Target Disk Mode? That feature has been very helpful when I'm retrieving data from a user's Mac.
    1. tyewonawn's Avatar
      tyewonawn -
      I'm a video editor and I need firewire not for cameras but for hard drives. Although I love Macbook Pros, sometimes it's easier to bring a smaller Macbook on the road. In fact when I travel I always bring the Macbook and 2 drives to edit from. While I seriously need better graphics support, I'm not willing to spend the extra $800 - $1000 to get a firewire port. Let's face it, the only real difference now between the Macbook and Macbook Pro (besides storage size and slight processor speed bumps) is the screen size. From what I here, as I've not personally tested one, the new Macbooks keep up nicely with the new Macbook Pros, and editing is said to be amazing in comparison to the older Macbooks.

      I think Apple really faltered by removing the firewire port on the new line. Based on this decision I will stick with my current "travel" Macbook until either Apple includes it on the next update, or my current one completely melts down.

      If Steve Jobs decides to say that "You can edit from a USB 2 drive..." I'll have to give him the finger.

      I currently use an 8 core Mac Pro with dual 23" screens at the office, I have 2 iMac's at home and I even have an iPhone...it would be nice if Apple could keep their current fans happy and not try to muscle extra money out of them for a much needed port.
    1. se23's Avatar
      se23 -
      Quote Originally Posted by davidmdowning42 View Post
      I understand looking to the future and this move doesn't surprise me.

      BUT it seems to me that a major selling point of Apple is that makes really high quality hardware that is built to last. Steve always says that Apple won't ship junk. And that is supposed to be why their hardware is so expensive. Like say, my wife's G2 iPod. It still works great and needs a firewire port. I know that Apple, like any company, would rather me buy a new iPod than hang on to the old one for more than 5 years. But then why make it so well? Why insist on the highest quality parts that drive up the price of all of their machines, only to short-cut their durability by purposefully doing things like this? It undermines the whole rationale behind making such expensive machines. If they aren't going to keep supporting older products that still work because they are so well made, then they might as well stop making them so well and make them cheaper.
      BUT it seems to me that a major selling point of Apple is that makes really high quality hardware that is built to last

      I guess you havent googled crackbook, mine whitebook been fixed twice and its not even a year yet, blackbook sold yesterday after 6 months! I treat my books like cotton wall
    1. Eurisko's Avatar
      Eurisko -
      Quote Originally Posted by organik View Post
      Actually, there is no such thing as usb2 to firewire cable, or adapter. They are not compatible, in any way.

      There is usb2 to usb1.1 and firewire 800 to firewire 400, but those are part of each respective standard.

      To repeat, because this misinformation is flying around everywhere...it is impossible to use firewire devices with a usb2 connection!
      Never say impossible when it comes to electronics communications. There will be adapters.