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  • RIM, Nokia Fire Back at Apple

    As expected, the smartphone manufacturers that Apple dragged into its own iPhone 4 reception mess have not responded favorably to the sweeping accusations made by Apple chief Steve Jobs during Friday's much talked about press conference. During the presentation in which Jobs announced a free case distribution program for iPhone 4 owners, a very large target was made out of Apple's biggest competitors in the smartphone marketplace.

    Alluding to the infamous Death Grip, Jobs said this sort of thing "doesn't just happen to the iPhone." In fact, he boldly asserted that the likes of "Nokia, Motorola and other phones" have the same nagging issue. He then went on to demonstrate how the BlackBerry Bold 9700 and the Samsung Omnia II similarly lose bars when held improperly. Following the presentation, Apple.com unveiled a whole new wing to the site that is pretty much exclusively dedicated to explaining that other smartphones also have fatal reception problems. In fact, this is just about the most attention Apple has ever given to its competition. Of course, none of this attention is positive. And, as a result, there are some angry executives at competing companies that are firing back at Cupertino less than twenty-four hours since Apple fired the first shot.

    Mike Lazaridis and Jim Balsillie - the CEOs of RIM (the makers of Blackberry) - issued a formal and scathing response to Apple's harsh critiques.

    Apple's attempt to draw RIM into Apple's self-made debacle is unacceptable. Apple's claims about RIM products appear to be deliberate attempts to distort the public's understanding of an antenna design issue and to deflect attention from Apple's difficult situation. RIM is a global leader in antenna design and has been successfully designing industry-leading wireless data products with efficient and effective radio performance for over 20 years. During that time, RIM has avoided designs like the one Apple used in the iPhone 4 and instead has used innovative designs which reduce the risk for dropped calls, especially in areas of lower coverage. One thing is for certain, RIM's customers don't need to use a case for their BlackBerry smartphone to maintain proper connectivity. Apple clearly made certain design decisions and it should take responsibility for these decisions rather than trying to draw RIM and others into a situation that relates specifically to Apple.
    Shortly after RIM's chief executives issued choice words to Apple, Nokia followed suit, offering the following:

    Antenna design is a complex subject and has been a core competence at Nokia for decades, across hundreds of phone models. Nokia was the pioneer in internal antennas; the Nokia 8810, launched in 1998, was the first commercial phone with this feature. Nokia has invested thousands of man hours in studying human behavior, including how people hold their phones for calls, music playing, web browsing and so on. As you would expect from a company focused on connecting people, we prioritize antenna performance over physical design if they are ever in conflict. In general, antenna performance of a mobile device/phone may be affected with a tight grip, depending on how the device is held. That’s why Nokia designs our phones to ensure acceptable performance in all real life cases, for example when the phone is held in either hand. Nokia has invested thousands of man hours in studying how people hold their phones and allows for this in designs, for example by having antennas both at the top and bottom of the phone and by careful selection of materials and their use in the mechanical design.
    Other smartphone makers tossed under the bus by Apple are yet to respond. But something tells us they are hard at work this weekend preparing a well-crafted response to the far-reaching jabs Apple took on Friday to distract from the iPhone 4 "Death Grip" that Steve Jobs maintains is vastly overblown in the press.

    This article was originally published in forum thread: RIM, Nokia Fire Back at Apple started by Michael Essany View original post
    Comments 248 Comments
    1. EddieLeonard's Avatar
      EddieLeonard -
      Quote Originally Posted by imilad View Post
      my iphone 4 does not drop a single bar when I hold it... weird how its just some phones
      it has something to do with area signal strength. if your in a week area then covering your phone will make it next to impossible to keep connection but if your in a strong signal area most of the signal will get to the phone easy enough
    1. bobby563's Avatar
      bobby563 -
      Quote Originally Posted by btung View Post
      I guess everyone must bash apple because 1,500 outta their 3,000,000 users are having this issue and they can't return a phone that they don't like but instead have to bash it and go on about it.
      It's not 1,500 its 16500.
    1. jdyates's Avatar
      jdyates -
      Typical of SJ, blame everyone else.
    1. cyberbia242ph's Avatar
      cyberbia242ph -
      Hmm, if you're unhappy with your iPhone4, just return it. It IS just a phone. If you want you can send them to me. I still love Apple. Always have, always will.
    1. scatman10's Avatar
      scatman10 -
      Regardless as to whether or not all smartphones have "weak spots. I still think it is bs that apple's solution to this was a bumper. All this talk about how they just so happened to make it obvious with a little line telling you where to
      Put your finger in order to make it happen is just bs. When I spend top dollar to buy top of the line technology, I spend it because I want a flawless device that works well right out of the box. After all if I pay for a phone with a camera I want it
      built in not in an add-on that allows me to take pictures. And with the bumper solution why should I need an accessory to allow me to make calls and not have them dropped? makes no sense. Fix the problem, don't cover it up with a band aid. I mention my frustration for that "small percent of users who experience these problems. I am fortunate not to have this issue on my iPhone 4
    1. Brinky's Avatar
      Brinky -
      Quote Originally Posted by Luppin View Post
      ....while the iPhone 4 only has reception issues everywhere else on the face of the planet?
      Seeing how I can only replicate this "issue" on my iphone 4 about 50% of the time, how is it that you claim the iPhone 4 has this issue every where?
    1. iLoveWindows&iPhone's Avatar
      iLoveWindows&iPhone -
      From a personal prospective, I'm trying to tell u all why this has been so blown out of proportion.... Most people r windows users, including the media. Read my early post and u will see what my point is. Apple has alienated users for years. In my opinion, this is why there is so much negative attention focused on the i4. Many people hate apple, one example is there pc vs Mac commercials. Before the iPhone I was one of these people...couldn't stand apple, and there ridiculously lying commercials. Apple has made many enemies over the years, and now they r paying for it.

      Yes the i4 is amazing, love it, wouldn't trade it for anything.

      But there r still MANY PEOPLE
      out there that hate apple, and unfortunately apple is giving them ammo to hate on them more.
    1. nashlib's Avatar
      nashlib -
      COme on guys - U DON'T like it DON'T buy it -

      be fair - U were NOT born with it - IT IS NOT A BIRTH DEFECT.

      People who bought it - if u hate it beyond u hate how ur face or hair or eye or leg or balls looks


      Its Just a bloody Phone - Don't like it give it back - if u like it - just - Shut - UP.

      I - nor my Wife - or any of my friends who bought it with me have any issues - none what - so - ever and i DON't use a bumper or case.
    1. Antman217's Avatar
      Antman217 -
      It's even present in former iPhones! Just did it on my 3G and it's there! The reason it's such a big deal is because it's an iPhone. Like a person in a previous post said, where was all the attention when other sh*t phones did the same thing. The media likes a story and people like to add to the flame... especially on a big successful company like apple. I don't know if there are many ps3 owners here but it's like when Sony removed the install other OS from the ps3 in a software update. Every ps3 owners started flipping out over a feature that probably over 90% of ps3 owners didn't even use. I bet most of these people here complaining don't even have an iPhone 4, yet they start saying they're gonna leave apple... and then next year those are the first people in line for the next iPhone. And about the case... come on you know you were going to buy one anyways almost everyone has an iPhone 3G/3GS case. Apple is giving you one for free!!! Take it!!!!

      I rethought about my previous comment and I forgot to think about how those with the problem actually might feel and I guess I would be pretty mad if that was happening to me as well and I would be kinda frustrated at apple for not giving us a real solution to the problem but not so angry that I would bash as hard as some people here. I would logically go get my free case or get a full refund and buy an iPhone 3GS... are you really gonna leave apple after having an iPhone 4. I've played with it at the apple store and I still wanna get one lol. But honestly hope this gets fixed for you guys having problems
    1. cadsii's Avatar
      cadsii -
      Quote Originally Posted by GranDaddyPurp View Post
      people are just paying way TOO MUCH attention on Apple and the iPhone 4. In my opinion, I think this whole death grip/antenna issue was blown way out of proportion.
      **** finally... someone with some sense... gee its 1/3 of the number of 3gs returns.. which was still better then any other phone...

      People will do anything to ***** now... Steve said you dont like it dont keep it, its pretty simple, and with 1 million units selling a week its not like people dont like it, obviously they do cause the phone provides features and look that no other phone does, this is why you are here right now on this forum, cause you joined when you got your first awesome iphone, now you will ***** about anything....

      Dont like it, return it and move on, stop your winning.. And go head to BBforums and ***** there about their ugly phones...

      And only reason they compared it to other phones, just to show that this is not ONLY an iPHone issue.
      Next you'll see videos of the iPhone going into the lake and people ******** about it that it stopped working after. What do you think apple will do, they will grab the top 10 phones and throw them all in the lake, why cause this is the easiest way to clear any confusion, they will show their product behaving ordinary, like other phones. I just dont get why people are ********, u CAN TAKE IT BACK if you dont want it.

      And for someone like me this set me clear because i never owed those other phones so i would have never been able to test it to compare.

      Competition is why we have the technology we have today, its great and advances us.
    1. Roofiya's Avatar
      Roofiya -
      I really think as he said "blown out of proportion", this iPhone4 was on everyone's list to buy since they announced it. Now the question is: if he offered to give full refund to anyone who is not satisfied with the product, how many people really would go and give their iPhone back? I doubt that any will.The figures will come soon and we shall see. I know that ever since I bought my first iPhone 2G, I never wanted to go back and buy any other phone. Now how many of you know and feel the same way ?
    1. zozodouce's Avatar
      zozodouce -
      steve is douche.
    1. QuinnNebula's Avatar
      QuinnNebula -
      iPhone 4 iPhone 4 iPhone 4! all it has done is cause problems -.- and it the only thing MMI post about now
    1. Blade600rr06's Avatar
      Blade600rr06 -
      The song was great but so tired of this subject...blown out of proportion! Let's talk about something fun like a jailbreak update! Please....
    1. roshansri's Avatar
      roshansri -
      Quote Originally Posted by Thailocalguy808 View Post
      Beautiful the way I see it apple has done no wrong they shown full blown proof that the iPhone isn't the only phone that has that flaw and for all u aholes dissing the iPhone return it and go buy a blackberry it will give u same issue also I'm betting that another company is the culprit for starting this issue so I don't blame apple for cracking at anyone the i4

      Beautiful the way I see it apple has done no wrong they shown full blown proof that the iPhone isn't the only phone that has that flaw and for all u aholes dissing the iPhone return it and go buy a blackberry it will give u same issue also I'm betting that another company is the culprit for starting this issue so I don't blame apple for cracking at anyone the i4 is great no problems accept reading bout u morons whining like babies
      Hey moron, listen your like the biggest apple fan out there from what you just posted, let me shed some light under that rock you live in. First off none of the rim phones let alone nokia I have tested and sold have any issues and this so called death grip. I am so suprised that you got couple of morons on this site point fingers and say its rite on apple's case to call in big guns by pointing fingers. let alone say this death grip is blow out of proportion, when a customer buys a product they have expectation, this is not a small issue we are talking about calls being dropped with this death grip, you are not buying a ipod touch here, empasis on the word "phone" hence people are frustrated cause of this what good is this if you got calls being dropped. Second we just cant turn a blind eye to the fact that oh everything is fixed just add the bumper to the phone its wrong when you build a unit build it rite. When they introduced the ip4 even steave jobs had issues with connecting to the wireless and he blames the crowd for having too many users using there wifi come on what a load of bull. When a company clearly knows that they messed up you they should just simply apologize for their stupidity instead of looking like idiots!!! For all the apple fan boys everyone has the rite to complain or boast just dont go trash talking about other users opinion. Sure apple f'uped but i still like apple some people might not. After this its there choice whether they like apple or not. shut up and just deal with it. P.S Apple you really did mess this one up but steve know matter how old you get and how dum you get you'll still make money so just own up to your mistake moron!
    1. lilscrappydew25's Avatar
      lilscrappydew25 -
      Have you ever heard of rooting your Andriod phone. Similar to jailbreak with much less options and developments. Plus the battery life (in refrence to the EVO) is downright pitiful. People are criticizing Apple but it's funny how those same companies that people are posting responses to Jobs shedding light, or falsly acusing them about antennas in general, that have been in the business for years, tripped over themselves in 2007 trying to get a touch screen phone to compete against the iPhone, to production( remember the sorry Blackberry Storm, RIM the leader in the smartphone field felt threatened enough to create a rival phone). So if you try to innovate you will get bashed for it. We all can remember in 2007 the same journalist writing that Apple's iPhone would never work because they don't have physical keyboards on their phones, fast forward 2010 I think it's safe to say that was a start of a trend, as will the antenna design as soon as Rim, Motorola, HTC and Nokia figure out how to duplicate it. It's hilarious that people say I'm getting rid of my iPhone today, I'm so mad at Apple, yet in the same sentence they say I'm going to wait till September and buy it again. Does anybody see the irony?
    1. nicksti's Avatar
      nicksti -
      Apple haters blowing this out of proportion? Get real. You have people in this very thread that have owned the 2G, 3G, and 3GS and are dissappointed with the 4. How can you be a hater if you have owned every iPhone to come out.

      Also, why do we have documented evidence pre this firestorm of antenna engineers stating the iPhone's external antenna design is a cause of concern?

      This happens to every smartphone and not many people are complaining? Then why give away free stuff? And notice how we were given only a percentage of people who purchased AppleCare that complained about reception issues. How many people actually buy AppleCare?
    1. spiderguy84's Avatar
      spiderguy84 -
      Quote Originally Posted by Luppin View Post
      Thank god RIM called Apple out on their BS. I really can't believe that a multi-billion dollar international corporation like Apple would resort to "Antenna issue? Oh, well uh.....HAY LOOK AT THESE OTHER PHONES!!! THEY HAVE RECEPTION ISSUES TOO!! A Fix? Oh, well uh.....FREE CASES, FOR EVERYONE!!" And what was hilarious was when one of the reporters there sat there with his Blackberry Bold during the Q&A and was unable to replicate the reception issue, all Steve Jobs could say was "You may not see it in certain areas." So the Blackberry Bold (which Apple bashed in their press conference) only has reception issues in 100 million dollar testing facilities, while the iPhone 4 only has reception issues everywhere else on the face of the planet? Really don't see myself buying the iPhone 5 after all this.
      Really? Are you that much of an idiot??? 3 weeks of everyone bashing Apple for this, and they're the bad guys for reminding everyone that every cell phone loses signal if you block the antenna location? As far as the reporter with the Blackberry Bold...I can't reproduce the death grip on my iPhone 4. When I mention that I can't reproduce it, I get tons of angry Apple haters telling me that they know of people that can, and just because I'm lucky doesn't mean there isn't a problem. Why is no one saying the same thing to that Blackberry Bold user? It's exactly the same situation and argument.
    1. vedavis's Avatar
      vedavis -
      Worried about reception issue? Then let's go back to the days of telescoping antennas. Most people are ignorant about wireless transmission and signal attenuation and wavelength antennae. Don't know what I'm talking about? Then STFU and live with it.
    1. DontBeJealous's Avatar
      DontBeJealous -
      All you .55%ers need to go away so we can get back to our usually conversations on MMI.